Father Ryan vs. Independence

[WrestlingGod]

What happened last evening? Everyone has been on this board talking like Indy may be the strongest team from top to bottom in Tennessee. What did Ryan do against Indy that they did not do against Blackman or did FR just match up well against Indy?

 

Midway through the season, Indy was obviously not at 100%. No excuses for the loss, Ryan wrestled a heck of a match. But I think it would have been alot more interesting if the Independence team had no injuries.

[maj]

what does this great win do for the D1 vs. D2 study............LOL

 

 

It was a big enough win to keep the debate going a while longer.

 

Congratulations Father Ryan on a great performance.

[ghouse]

Midway through the season, Indy was obviously not at 100%. No excuses for the loss, Ryan wrestled a heck of a match. But I think it would have been alot more interesting if the Independence team had no injuries.

 

 

What injuries did Independence have? What I saw was mostly the same starting line-up I saw a couple of weeks ago.

[Sommers]

Independence (1/22/09) FR 38 - IN 21

103 Moseley (FR) pinned Adams (IN) :15

112 Maurizi (FR) dec Overton (IN) 8-6

119 Simpson (FR) maj Bratt (IN) 8-0

125 Chase Beazley (IN) pinned Campbell (FR) :23

130 Wright (FR) dec Heithcock (IN) 8-7

135 Brewer (FR) pinned A. Cox (IN) 3:27

140 Austell (FR) dec Seneca (IN) 3-1

145 B. Cox (IN) dec Bateman (FR) 4-1

152 Newburg (IN) pinned Agnew (FR) 1:40

160 Marchetti (FR) maj Sinsheimer (IN) 14-4

171 Wesley (FR) dec Dixon (IN) 3-1

189 Mix (FR) dec King (IN) 4-2

215 Norcross (FR) dec Berry (IN) 8-3

285 Burge (IN) pinned Obi (FR) 5:16

 

10 matches to 4 in favor of Father Ryan. With Ryan winning 2 matches decided by a point, 3 matches decided by 2 points, and 1 match by three points versus Indy winning 1 match by 3 points. That is 6 wins out of 7 "close" matches. I think you can say that Father Ryan plan and simply won the close matches and sealed the dual. Those performances are what win important dual meets!

 

 

Hey PBD - the upper weights did alright here this time around, huh? State duals should be interesting huh?

[MWR]

Well what do we have here- Ryan beats a good Indy team, who layed a beating on Blackman ( Yeah yeah it was early in the year and wrestlers weren't in their correct weights right, pbd? Which still doesn't explain a 44-16 loss), yet at the time tnko and others were proclaiming the obvious proof of DII being an inferior division. Hmm it just doesn't make much sense.

 

So, tnko, it looks like Indy won't hold onto their rank as you hoped and hopefully this might explain why Ryan is still ahead of Blackman in the poll. However, since those polls are so important when it comes to February, I'll leave it for you to ponder and waste your time.

 

 

Go Irish

[pattonboysdad]

Well what do we have here- Ryan beats a good Indy team, who layed a beating on Blackman ( Yeah yeah it was early in the year and wrestlers weren't in their correct weights right, pbd? Which still doesn't explain a 44-16 loss), yet at the time tnko and others were proclaiming the obvious proof of DII being an inferior division. Hmm it just doesn't make much sense.

 

So, tnko, it looks like Indy won't hold onto their rank as you hoped and hopefully this might explain why Ryan is still ahead of Blackman in the poll. However, since those polls are so important when it comes to February, I'll leave it for you to ponder and waste your time.

 

 

Go Irish

 

 

MWR...not sure why you would mention my name here because i have been nothing but encouraging to ryan and indy in public (on the T) and privately (to both coaches of ryan and indy)...but since you did...

 

indy did beat us bad at the first of the year and then by two points a few weeks later...personally i think indy is the overall better team (more strength from top to bottom) than blackman...but i do think that indy hurt their overall strenth by dropping several guys down a weight class (152, 160,171)...but that is their call to make and it is just an observation and opinion of mine and i'm sure they don't care what i think...which it how it should be...i do know indy is beat up at the moment and my hopes are with them and every other team is that they would be healthy going into state duals...their coaches would tell you they were a stronger team at the first of the year than they are now because of injuries...and specifically to your comment...we did not have all our wrestlers in the right places or even wrestling the first time we met indy and did a few weeks later and still got beat...but i have never mentioned that as an excuse

 

on ryan...i said here on the T that i was surprised that we beat ryan and did not think we could this year...encouraged but surprised...i also said that maybe i should not have been surprised that we beat ryan because the sharpshooters have beat their nashville catholic teams for several years...and if we did not eventually beat them then something is not going well with our high school coaches (and i think our coaches have been doing an excellent job)...this is just logical thinking on my part which i'm not very good at /flower.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":flower:" border="0" alt="flower.gif" /> ...i also gave kudos to several of your wrestlers...coaches...and to your parents and fans after their visit to our place on the T...ryan has had a great program for a LONG time and great coaching has been a huge part of that...

 

on ryan beating indy...all i have said is it should be a good one (before the match was wrestled) and gave some opinions of where the strentgh of each lineup was... and up to now did not comment on it after the match...i was a little surprised that norcross beat berry...but good for him and congrads to him

 

and speaking of rankings...part of me says who cares?...and the other part says ... "if you beat someone ranked higher than you, you ought to move up accordingly"...but again...i really don't spend alot of time on this...i think blackman is 26-2 on the year and that has encouraged me after being apart of my youngin's first two years on the team when we could not even put a full team on the mat...i have enjoyed the process of seeing a team built...thankful for coach kennedy and the sharpshooters and their impact...and hopeful for a good showing at state duals and state...i think i feel like most fans of their teams...but i have never beat my chest in an arrogant way for the blaze...and always try to encourage other teams, wrestlers and coaches...if i have failed to do that...let me know because i have considered that one of my highest priorities

 

PBD

[MWR]

MWR...not sure why you would mention my name here because i have been nothing but encouraging to ryan and indy in public (on the T) and privately (to both coaches of ryan and indy)...but since you did...

 

indy did beat us bad at the first of the year and then by two points a few weeks later...personally i think indy is the overall better team (more strength from top to bottom) than blackman...but i do think that indy hurt their overall strenth by dropping several guys down a weight class (152, 160,171)...but that is their call to make and it is just an observation and opinion of mine and i'm sure they don't care what i think...which it how it should be...i do know indy is beat up at the moment and my hopes are with them and every other team is that they would be healthy going into state duals...their coaches would tell you they were a stronger team at the first of the year than they are now because of injuries...and specifically to your comment...we did not have all our wrestlers in the right places or even wrestling the first time we met indy and did a few weeks later and still got beat...but i have never mentioned that as an excuse

 

on ryan...i said here on the T that i was surprised that we beat ryan and did not think we could this year...encouraged but surprised...i also said that maybe i should not have been surprised that we beat ryan because the sharpshooters have beat their nashville catholic teams for several years...and if we did not eventually beat them then something is not going well with our high school coaches (and i think our coaches have been doing an excellent job)...this is just logical thinking on my part which i'm not very good at /flower.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":flower:" border="0" alt="flower.gif" /> ...i also gave kudos to several of your wrestlers...coaches...and to your parents and fans after their visit to our place on the T...ryan has had a great program for a LONG time and great coaching has been a huge part of that...

 

on ryan beating indy...all i have said is it should be a good one (before the match was wrestled) and gave some opinions of where the strentgh of each lineup was... and up to now did not comment on it after the match...i was a little surprised that norcross beat berry...but good for him and congrads to him

 

and speaking of rankings...part of me says who cares?...and the other part says ... "if you beat someone ranked higher than you, you ought to move up accordingly"...but again...i really don't spend alot of time on this...i think blackman is 26-2 on the year and that has encouraged me after being apart of my youngin's first two years on the team when we could not even put a full team on the mat...i have enjoyed the process of seeing a team built...thankful for coach kennedy and the sharpshooters and their impact...and hopeful for a good showing at state duals and state...i think i feel like most fans of their teams...but i have never beat my chest in an arrogant way for the blaze...and always try to encourage other teams, wrestlers and coaches...if i have failed to do that...let me know because i have considered that one of my highest priorities

 

PBD

 

 

PBD, my intention wasn't to bash your team because as I have said previously, Blackman was the better team against Ryan on THAT day. I also didn't intend to ruffle your feathers, I was speaking more towards tnko, who wrote after the match between our teams that DII is inferior. Which is ridiculous but that discussion is for another day.

 

And what starters for Indy didn't wrestle against Ryan? Ghouse, who does a good job with rankings all year long, stated that it looked like the same Indy team that has wrestled all year long. So it seems as if Ryan wrestled Indy's original team. Not trying to argue with you, just confused.

 

And I do applaud your encouragement of other schools' programs. It is great to see programs such as Blackman on the rise and I think we can agree it is crucial for high school programs to establish a feeder program if they want to compete for state championships... Best of luck to your Blaze at state.

[texas23]

PBD, my intention wasn't to bash your team because as I have said previously, Blackman was the better team against Ryan on THAT day. I also didn't intend to ruffle your feathers, I was speaking more towards tnko, who wrote after the match between our teams that DII is inferior. Which is ridiculous but that discussion is for another day.

 

And what starters for Indy didn't wrestle against Ryan? Ghouse, who does a good job with rankings all year long, stated that it looked like the same Indy team that has wrestled all year long. So it seems as if Ryan wrestled Indy's original team. Not trying to argue with you, just confused.

 

And I do applaud your encouragement of other schools' programs. It is great to see programs such as Blackman on the rise and I think we can agree it is crucial for high school programs to establish a feeder program if they want to compete for state championships... Best of luck to your Blaze at state.

 

 

 

ghouse did not say "all year long", he said a "couple of weeks ago", just to be accurate.

[pattonboysdad]

PBD, my intention wasn't to bash your team because as I have said previously, Blackman was the better team against Ryan on THAT day. I also didn't intend to ruffle your feathers, I was speaking more towards tnko, who wrote after the match between our teams that DII is inferior. Which is ridiculous but that discussion is for another day.

 

And what starters for Indy didn't wrestle against Ryan? Ghouse, who does a good job with rankings all year long, stated that it looked like the same Indy team that has wrestled all year long. So it seems as if Ryan wrestled Indy's original team. Not trying to argue with you, just confused.

 

And I do applaud your encouragement of other schools' programs. It is great to see programs such as Blackman on the rise and I think we can agree it is crucial for high school programs to establish a feeder program if they want to compete for state championships... Best of luck to your Blaze at state.

 

 

never thought or felt you bashed blackman as a team...and never really felt ruffled ...but did wonder why you would put my name in your post in the context of all that has been written about DI vs DII and who is better and in the context of blackman's ranking, beating father ryan etc...

 

SO...enlight of potential confusion with you and with future readers of this post...i wanted to make myself clear...about all that I HAVE SAID AND NOT SAID (it's called self protection /cool.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="B)" border="0" alt="cool.gif" /> in the context mentioned above...and yes...i am verbally gifted /rolleyes.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":rolleyes:" border="0" alt="rolleyes.gif" /> (or cursed...depends on your perspective) so i tend to be a little long winded in my response...

 

and tnko can speak definitively for himself...but i think what he and others meant with the DI vs. DII stuff is NOT that DII is inferior to DI overall...but that it is easier to place at the DII tournament than the DI tournament in most if not all weight classes...this is alot different than saying DI is better than DII overall...this seems to be logical in light of the hundreds of teams in DI vs. just a few in DII...(remember though...i'm not very good at logic...but to me it makes sense /flower.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":flower:" border="0" alt="flower.gif" /> )...that is what tnko referred too i think and the rock guy...but as soon is something is mentioned...emotions fly and DII fans and supporters read alot into it that is not there...again this is my limited opinion on the blackman beating father ryan thread based on what i have read...

 

and...i don't know the details of who wrestled for indy...i'm sure grinder could fill you in...i just knew they were pretty banged up as of the brentwood tournament...maybe father ryan beat them at full strength...good for them if they did...maybe losing to blackman put a fire under FR's rear end...again...good for us and them...

 

glad we could kiss and make up...heck...we're just a bunch of country bumpkins from the boro trying to learn how to wrestle people instead of wrestling them their pigs like we have all our lives...our boys are just making the transition from pigs to people...some similarities and alot of differences...so don't take me too seriously... /thumb[1].gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":thumb:" border="0" alt="thumb[1].gif" />

 

and... "THAT DAY" might ought to be changed to "THIS YEAR"! /thumb[1].gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":thumb:" border="0" alt="thumb[1].gif" />

[bear cat brown]

never thought or felt you bashed blackman as a team...and never really felt ruffled ...but did wonder why you would put my name in your post in the context of all that has been written about DI vs DII and who is better and in the context of blackman's ranking, beating father ryan etc...

 

SO...enlight of potential confusion with you and with future readers of this post...i wanted to make myself clear...about all that I HAVE SAID AND NOT SAID (it's called self protection /cool.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="B)" border="0" alt="cool.gif" /> in the context mentioned above...and yes...i am verbally gifted or cursed...depends on your perspective) so i tend to be a little long winded in my response...

 

and tnko can speak definitively for himself...but i think what he and others meant with the DI vs. DII stuff is NOT that DII is inferior to DI overall...but that it is easier to place at the DII tournament than the DI tournament in most if not all weight classes...this is alot different than saying DI is better than DII overall...this seems to be logical in light of the hundreds of teams in DI vs. just a few in DII...(remember though...i'm not very good at logic...but to me it makes sense /flower.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":flower:" border="0" alt="flower.gif" /> )...that is what tnko referred too i think and the rock guy...but as soon is something is mentioned...emotions fly and DII fans and supporters read alot into it that is not there...again this is my limited opinion on the blackman beating father ryan thread based on what i have read...

 

and...i don't know the details of who wrestled for indy...i'm sure grinder could fill you in...i just knew they were pretty banged up as of the brentwood tournament...maybe father ryan beat them at full strength...good for them if they did...maybe losing to blackman put a fire under FR's rear end...again...good for us and them...

 

glad we could kiss and make up...heck...we're just a bunch of country bumpkins from the boro trying to learn how to wrestle people instead of wrestling them their pigs like we have all our lives...our boys are just making the transition from pigs to people...some similarities and alot of differences...so don't take me too seriously...

 

and... "THAT DAY" might ought to be changed to "THIS YEAR"!

 

 

I'll agree with you on one thing PBD, you are long winded

 

bcb iii /flower.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":flower:" border="0" alt="flower.gif" />

[pattonboysdad]

I'll agree with you on one thing PBD, you are long winded

 

bcb iii /flower.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":flower:" border="0" alt="flower.gif" />

 

 

the proverbial pot calling the kettle black /roflol.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":roflol:" border="0" alt="roflol.gif" />

 

PBD

[tnko]

yet at the time tnko and others were proclaiming the obvious proof of DII being an inferior division. Hmm it just doesn't make much sense.

 

So, tnko, it looks like Indy won't hold onto their rank as you hoped and hopefully this might explain why Ryan is still ahead of Blackman in the poll. However, since those polls are so important when it comes to February, I'll leave it for you to ponder and waste your time.

 

 

Go Irish

 

I never used the work INFERIOR in my previous statements or context to support that word when speaking about Ryan.....they have an amazing team!!!!

 

I do agree however with BCB /flower.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":flower:" border="0" alt="flower.gif" /> that there ia a clear JV division at state though... and I cant wait to just watch the finals only in that QUARTER of the state.

 

Ill leave it to you to ponder which 1/4th I mean.