New Classification Idea

[DougS]

This is a serious question because I do not know the scenario or reasoning. 

You all know that there at one time was no separation between public and private? I know the first split was public and privates; then privates split again into large and small schools. Does anyone know why the split occured years ago?

 

 

Why or why must everyone else that keeps crying about the need to split, keep harping on the inequality that exists between privates and publics.  Jackson Christian just moved from D2A to D1A with an entrollment about 300 (maybe).  So because they move to D1 and are private, they should play against AAA schools?

 

I say, lets move JC and UC up to AAA because the girls' basketball has apparently dominated in AA and dropped to A where they have dominated as well.  They are too good to play against the other A teams so lets move them up for competition sake.  They should be playing teams as good as they are since it is all about fair competition, right?  Also, let's say any County school must play up becasue they have more students to pull from than  cities/towns that have more than one high school.  Oh, lets throw in any school district that has Open enrollment into the same discuss.  That is legalized and sanctioned recruiting.

 

Instead of complaining about other schools and the success they are having, how about do something to make your school better.  It doesnt take recruiting or financial aid to make the school better.  It takes the commitment from the team (school, admin, coaches, parents, players, fans) to get better and compete with [insert any team here]. 

 

Instead of spending hours on message boards, in the stores, gyms, work, home, in the car driving hating on private schools, spend the energy trying to raise money to build your school a weight room; upgrade the locker rooms; upgrade the football field to synthetic turf;  hire a better coaching staff and maybe hire better teachers. Because if the academics is just as good or better and the team is halfway good, kids will not go to the private school.

 

Adults complain and whine about "oh it is unfair, they have scholarships" ,  "They are better than us because they have scholarships." and the students hear it.  Now they have a built in excuse if they loose lose.  BOLOGNA.  Spend more time running; spend more time lifting; more time in the gym; hire a better coach.

 

"The best way to make your team better, is for YOU to get better."  - Coach Wooden

Edited March 6, 2014 by DougS

[Indian]

All that sounds good but the results speak for themselves.

[davidlimbaugh]

And I just realized I am starting to sound like Davidlimbaugh pushing this 3 teams advance thing.. Dear God.

 

I hear ya!   I like making the 3rd place game mean something.  Right now, if you are in a strong district and the other district is not as strong, it actually works to your advantage to lose the 3rd place game.  You will not face your district champion until the region finals, when all you are playing for is gas or coke sales....

[DougS]

I hear ya!   I like making the 3rd place game mean something.  Right now, if you are in a strong district and the other district is not as strong, it actually works to your advantage to lose the 3rd place game.  You will not face your district champion until the region finals, when all you are playing for is gas or coke sales....

 

 

if only 3 teams advance, they would have to make up new brackets and that would cost a fortune...

[crazzyness]

if only 3 teams advance, they would have to make up new brackets and that would cost a fortune...

They already the same bracket for the TMSAA sectional tournamnet. Only 3 teams advance from each area.

[UCSportsFan]

This is a serious question because I do not know the scenario or reasoning.

You all know that there at one time was no separation between public and private? I know the first split was public and privates; then privates split again into large and small schools. Does anyone know why the split occured years ago?

 

 

Why or why must everyone else that keeps crying about the need to split, keep harping on the inequality that exists between privates and publics. Jackson Christian just moved from D2A to D1A with an entrollment about 300 (maybe). So because they move to D1 and are private, they should play against AAA schools?

 

I say, lets move JC and UC up to AAA because the girls' basketball has apparently dominated in AA and dropped to A where they have dominated as well. They are too good to play against the other A teams so lets move them up for competition sake. They should be playing teams as good as they are since it is all about fair competition, right? Also, let's say any County school must play up becasue they have more students to pull from than cities/towns that have more than one high school. Oh, lets throw in any school district that has Open enrollment into the same discuss. That is legalized and sanctioned recruiting.

 

Instead of complaining about other schools and the success they are having, how about do something to make your school better. It doesnt take recruiting or financial aid to make the school better. It takes the commitment from the team (school, admin, coaches, parents, players, fans) to get better and compete with [insert any team here].

 

Instead of spending hours on message boards, in the stores, gyms, work, home, in the car driving hating on private schools, spend the energy trying to raise money to build your school a weight room; upgrade the locker rooms; upgrade the football field to synthetic turf; hire a better coaching staff and maybe hire better teachers. Because if the academics is just as good or better and the team is halfway good, kids will not go to the private school.

 

Adults complain and whine about "oh it is unfair, they have scholarships" , "They are better than us because they have scholarships." and the students hear it. Now they have a built in excuse if they loose lose. BOLOGNA. Spend more time running; spend more time lifting; more time in the gym; hire a better coach.

 

"The best way to make your team better, is for YOU to get better." - Coach Wooden

Doug is that how CPA built their team? By running more lifting more in the gym longer or did they just go find the kids that had been doing that and make them an offer they couldn't refuse? How many transfers will they have next year in football, basketball, baseball, softball, golf etc... ??? Thats how the private schools build their programs for the most part and we all know it my friend and so do you. However you prefer to turn a blind eye to. Why is that? In a small county school you will have maybe 4 or 5 good athletes and thats a big maybe. The same 15-20 kids play every sport the school offers. Friendship Christian advertised that 70% of their enrollment were athletes compared to maybe 10% at a county school if you are lucky. So you tell me where the advantage is? Edited March 6, 2014 by UCSportsFan

[crazzyness]

Doug is that how CPA built their team? By running more lifting more in the gym longer or did they just go find the kids that had been doing that and make them an offer they couldn't refuse? How many transfers will they have next year in football, basketball, baseball, softball, golf etc... ??? Thats how the private schools build their programs for the most part and we all know it my friend and so do you. However you prefer to turn a blind eye to. Why is that?

Exactly. And another thing to remember, teenage kids are exactly that, KIDS! They like new, nice, shiny things. If you gave a 16 year old the option of your beater that you've drove around for 15 years or a brand new car, they'll pick the brand new car every single time. Same as if you give a 15 or 16 year old kid the option of lifting weights and training in a weight room that smells of 40 yeard old stale sweat and rust as opposed to a nice, new $250,000 facility, well, you see where I'm going with this.

 

Its not that kids at private schools just work harder than public schools, its that the kids that work hard at the public schools sometimes decide they would rather go to the private schools. Follow the money. It applies to every age. Maybe for different reasons, but it still applies. A lot (not all, but a lot) of public schools just can't compete with the money. Not saying all privates have the money, but the ones winning usually do. Look at Grace, BoydBuc, CPA, Goodpasture. They have absolutely BEAUTIFUL facilities.

 

The only private I can think of that had great sucsess that didn't have money floating everywhere was Temple. Geeze that place was a dump lol.

[davidlimbaugh]

This is a serious question because I do not know the scenario or reasoning. 

You all know that there at one time was no separation between public and private? I know the first split was public and privates; then privates split again into large and small schools. Does anyone know why the split occured years ago?

 

 

Why or why must everyone else that keeps crying about the need to split, keep harping on the inequality that exists between privates and publics.  Jackson Christian just moved from D2A to D1A with an entrollment about 300 (maybe).  So because they move to D1 and are private, they should play against AAA schools?

 

I say, lets move JC and UC up to AAA because the girls' basketball has apparently dominated in AA and dropped to A where they have dominated as well.  They are too good to play against the other A teams so lets move them up for competition sake.  They should be playing teams as good as they are since it is all about fair competition, right?  Also, let's say any County school must play up becasue they have more students to pull from than  cities/towns that have more than one high school.  Oh, lets throw in any school district that has Open enrollment into the same discuss.  That is legalized and sanctioned recruiting.

 

Instead of complaining about other schools and the success they are having, how about do something to make your school better.  It doesnt take recruiting or financial aid to make the school better.  It takes the commitment from the team (school, admin, coaches, parents, players, fans) to get better and compete with [insert any team here]. 

 

Instead of spending hours on message boards, in the stores, gyms, work, home, in the car driving hating on private schools, spend the energy trying to raise money to build your school a weight room; upgrade the locker rooms; upgrade the football field to synthetic turf;  hire a better coaching staff and maybe hire better teachers. Because if the academics is just as good or better and the team is halfway good, kids will not go to the private school.

 

Adults complain and whine about "oh it is unfair, they have scholarships" ,  "They are better than us because they have scholarships." and the students hear it.  Now they have a built in excuse if they loose.  BOLOGNA.  Spend more time running; spend more time lifting; more time in the gym; hire a better coach.

 

"The best way to make your team better, is for YOU to get better."  - Coach Wooden

 

I know the history of the public-private split.  Football.   A couple of schools..   

 

It is easy to write "Coach Better, Train Better, Play Better..."

 

But it takes Joes and Janes as well as Xs and Os....

 

It is easier to win with girls that can shoot and dribble.  And all the coaching in the world doesn't

make a 5'3 girl a 5'9 post player or make them faster.....

[Indian]

Here is what I would prefer, I came up with this for basketball:

 

Four Classes, no private schools

Class A to Hampton at 429

Class AA to Crockett County at 782

Class AAA to Knoxville West at 1244

Class AAAA to Blackman at 2381

 

These numbers could go up or down slightly each year or classification period. It might seem unnecessary to go to four classes but if you stuck with three and did it equally, Class A would rise to about 575 and Class AA would go to about 1150.

 

I'd also do football dividing by only football schools, and take a look at dividing other sports just by the schools participating, not the number of schools as a whole in the TSSAA.

[DougS]

Doug is that how CPA built their team? By running more lifting more in the gym longer or did they just go find the kids that had been doing that and make them an offer they couldn't refuse? How many transfers will they have next year in football, basketball, baseball, softball, golf etc... ??? Thats how the private schools build their programs for the most part and we all know it my friend and so do you. However you prefer to turn a blind eye to. Why is that? In a small county school you will have maybe 4 or 5 good athletes and thats a big maybe. The same 15-20 kids play every sport the school offers. Friendship Christian advertised that 70% of their enrollment were athletes compared to maybe 10% at a county school if you are lucky. So you tell me where the advantage is?

I know the history of the public-private split. Football. A couple of schools..

 

It is easy to write "Coach Better, Train Better, Play Better..."

 

But it takes Joes and Janes as well as Xs and Os....

 

It is easier to win with girls that can shoot and dribble. And all the coaching in the world doesn't

make a 5'3 girl a 5'9 post player or make them faster.....

UC, I don't turn a blind eye, never have, never will. But what I do is turn my focus on what I can do to help make my team better. And complaining and hollering about unfair unfair is not how to make my team better. And if school X had the facilities and academics, there would be no transfers.

 

Curious about why no comments on JC moving to AAA to make it fair to the other A class teams obviously, they have something better at that school that makes them so dominate.

 

DavidL, I don't know the history and that's why I was asking. What is easier, is to write, "unfair, unfair, they give scholarships. That's so unfair to us poor public schools". What's hard is doing something about it.

 

 

Call it what one will, but this conversation about splitting public and private is nothing more than (pun intended) class warfare. The rich private schools stealing the students and beating the poor public schools. Bool hooo

Edited March 7, 2014 by DougS

[attila]

UC, I don't turn a blind eye, never have, never will. But what I do is turn my focus on what I can do to help make my team better. And complaining and hollering about unfair unfair is not how to make my team better. And if school X had the facilities and academics, there would be no transfers.

Curious about why no comments on JC moving to AAA to make it fair to the other A class teams obviously, they have something better at that school that makes them so dominate.

DavidL, I don't know the history and that's why I was asking. What is easier, is to write, "unfair, unfair, they give scholarships. That's so unfair to us poor public schools". What's hard is doing something about it.

Call it what one will, but this conversation about splitting public and private is nothing more than (pun intended) class warfare. The rich private schools stealing the students and beating the poor public schools. Bool hooo

This thing started as a Football issue in the 90's when the smaller public schools kept losing to the small private schools In the playoffs. It had a ripple effect in that it made the Union City's, Jackson County's and Humbolt's of the world move from AA to A. This initiated the 'split' of D-1 and D-2 schools across the state. To say there is not a gap between most public and private school facilities is to not see the real problem. Why do the private schools need 2 state champions in basketball/football when only about 40 schools compete in the 2 classes combined? Why do we need 6 state champions in D-1 Football?

It makes no sense. We have more schools that play basketball statewide than we do Football across the state. Truthfully, the TSSAA doesn't care about other sports, football rules the roost. But ask yourself this simple question, how does Alabama, who we all would agree is a true Football state, outdraw and outperform the Tennessee basketball tournament year in and year out?

We have several ex-football coaches on the legislative council and the board of control of TSSAA who certainly don't want the others sports to approach the level of popularity of football.

Also, looking at the football playoff format, it seems that everyone gets in, but I know this, when you lose you are out. Unlike the never ending, we'll give you 2nd and just for measure 3rd chances to get to state or win it, basketball tourney. Part of the fun of the tournament is to see the Florida Gulf Coast's and VCU's make runs through the tournament and the favorites get upset!

[tradertwo]

UC, I don't turn a blind eye, never have, never will. But what I do is turn my focus on what I can do to help make my team better. And complaining and hollering about unfair unfair is not how to make my team better. And if school X had the facilities and academics, there would be no transfers.

 

Curious about why no comments on JC moving to AAA to make it fair to the other A class teams obviously, they have something better at that school that makes them so dominate.

 

DavidL, I don't know the history and that's why I was asking. What is easier, is to write, "unfair, unfair, they give scholarships. That's so unfair to us poor public schools". What's hard is doing something about it.

 

 

Call it what one will, but this conversation about splitting public and private is nothing more than (pun intended) class warfare. The rich private schools stealing the students and beating the poor public schools. Bool hooo

You had a quote in your previous post about Jackson Christian moving from DIIA to DIA and competing with around 300( couldn't verify, it's a secret ) students...you do realize that they have actively recruited a city of 76,000 people for four years and offered scholarships, and that those same kids are now playing in the public division right? FYI...Webb School of Knoxville and Ensworth have only around 450 students each, and both are doing OK in sports...why doesn't poor little 'ol JCS recruit a few more kids and play against schools with the same restrictions? Boo Hoo that.