TSSAA Officiating

[cobrakid8]

1 hour ago, Mason422 said:

Serious question to the folks that keep making the type of comments that if you don’t like the officiating that they should just go do it themselves. Why do you feel that way?  Don’t you think that officials should be very proficient and professional while doing their “job” that we get paid to do?   

FIRST, I DO NOT KNOW OF ANY REFEREE NOT TRYING TO DO THEIR BEST OUT THERE IN A MATCH. LET ME KNOW HOW MANY YOU HAVE SEEN OR EVEN REFFED WITH THAT WENT, IM GOING TO SCREW THIS KID BECAUSE I REALLY CARE ABOUT WHO WINS OR LOSES OR I AM HERE FOR THE MONEY! 

 

Name me another profession that we say that about?  If you go to a restaurant and your food isn’t cooked properly are you not allowed to complain?  If you do should you have to become a cook or a restaurant owner?   If a doctor doesn’t diagnose you correctly are you gonna go to medical school?  If your teacher does a bad job with your child should you become a teacher?  Not trying to be a jerk at all I just truly don’t understand the mentality. People should be allowed to have a reasonable expectation to have quality officiating. 
 

We hold every profession to a high standard, so why not refs? 

BECAUSE THIS IS NOT A FULL TIME JOB, HOW STUPID IS THAT! THIS ISNT REALLY A PROFESSION UNLESS YOU ARE MAKING A LIVING AT IT! SO LET ME KNOW IF YOU ARE AND I WILL START COMING TO MATCHES YOU REF AND LETTING YOU HAVE IT THAT YOU SUCK, ITS PRETTY SIMPLE! AS FAR AS GOING TO A RESTAURANT AND LETTING THE COOK KNOW THEY SCREWED UP YOUR ORDER, AGAIN THATS USUALLY THEIR PRIMARY JOB, THEY MAKE A LIVING DOING IT AND FOR THE MOST PART THEY ARENT JUST SPENDING THEIR WEEKENDS OR A FEW WEEKNIGHTS AWAY FROM THEIR FAMILIES AFTER THEY ALREADY WORKED A FULL TIME JOB DOING THE JOB BECAUSE THEY LOVE THE SPORT. ALSO MOST OF US HAVE COOKED BUT NOT ALL OF US HAVE REFFED A WRESTLING MATCH. I MEAN WOULD I BE OK TO COME SCREAM AT YOU ABOUT HOW TERRIBLE YOU ARE AT YOUR ACTUAL PROFESSION WHEN IVE NEVER ONCE PROB DONE IT? I MEAN WHAT IF YOU ARE A NUCLEAR SCIENTIST AND I THINK YOU SUCK AT IT, BUT I LITERALLY DONT KNOW HOW TO BE A NUCLEAR SCIENTIST, CAN I STILL YELL AT YOU THAT YOU SUCK AT IT, MAYBE WANT YOU FIRED? YEAH THESE PARENTS HAVE BEEN WATCHING WRESTLING FOR YEARS, HECK MAYBE SOME EVEN WRESTLED THEMSELVES, BUT I THINK ITS A TOTALLY DIFFERENT THING TO BE OUT THERE AS A REF THAN IT IS AS A PARENT, COACH OR EVEN A WRESTLER! I DONT KNOW THE FULL RULEBOOK, I MIGHT THINK I DO BUT I DONT. SO YEAH, THERE IS A REASON WHY THAT IS USED, COME ON OUT HERE AND SHOW ME HOW ITS DONE, IM SURE YOU ARE GOING TO BE SO AWESOME AT IT!

 

 

Having said all of that, I welcome the coaches and parents to discuss calls properly with me when time allows. Why wouldn’t I want to listen to them and get their perspective?  I have learned a lot over the years by asking questions and getting asked questions. 
 

IN EVERYTHING I HAVE EVER BEEN AN OFFICIAL AT I TAKE THE TIME TO ANSWER A COACHES QUESTION FOR ME, I DO NOT ANSWER FROM PARENTS, SORRY, IT BECOMES A VERY THIN LINE WHEN YOU ALLOW THAT AND IM NOT SURE YOUR ASSIGNOR WOULD MUCH APPRECIATE IT EITHER. TAKE IT UP WITH THE COACH BECAUSE THAT IS THEIR JOB TO DEFEND THEIR KID AND TRY TO MAKE THINGS RIGHT. YOU AS A PARENT ARE NOT NEEDED, SORRY IF THAT SUCKS TO HEAR, BUT AS I WAS TOLD IN A VERY HIGH LEVEL MEETING WITH SOCCER AND REFEREES IN GENERAL. A GAME CANNOT HAPPEN WITHOUT A COACH AND WITHOUT A REFEREE, THEY CAN TAKE PLACE WITHOUT FANS IN THE STANDS, SO YOUR ATTENDANCE IS NOT REQUIRED AND IN THE END WE ARE DOING WHAT WE ARE DOING FOR THE KIDS ON THAT MAT OR THAT SOCCER FIELD. IF THERE ARE NO REFEREES THERE ARE NO COMPETITIVE SPORTS. SO AGAIN I WILL TALK TO A COACH AND EXPLAIN THE REASONING ON MY CALLS, I CAN USUALLY SEE THEIR POINT OF VIEW EVEN BECAUSE SOMETIMES BEING ON TOP OF THE ACTION ITSELF INSTEAD OF SITTING IN THE COACHES CORNER THERE MIGHT BE SMALL THINGS YOU MISS, HECK WE ARE HUMAN, WE DO MAKE MISTAKES, I OWN UP TO THEM AND GET BETTER, BUT IN THE END YOU YELLING BECAUSE LITTLE JOHNNY DIDNT GET A CALL YOU THOUGHT HE SHOULD ISNT GOING TO CHANGE ANYTHING, EXCEPT MAKE YOU LOOK AN IDIOT FOR YELLING. 

Bottom line, rules are changing all of the time and as a ref I feel it is my job to stay current. The day I am not willing to continue to study and get better is the day I will stop being an offical.  So, parents and coaches if you see this short bald guy at a tournament feel free to give me some feedback if you think I can do something better. We may not agree but I will promise you that I will take a hard look at it.  
 

HOW MUCH DO YOU ACTUALLY DO WITH BIG TIME TOURNAMENTS SINCE YOUR SON WRESTLES AND HAS WRESTLED? AS FAR AS RULES CHANGING ALL THE TIME, THAT IS TRUE, ITS WHY ITS REQUIRED TO GO TO CONTUINING EDUCATION MEETINGS FOR EACH REGION. ITS ALSO WHY YOU PAY A FEE EVERY YEAR TO RE-CERT AND TO PAY THE FEE TO THE STATE TO BE ABLE TO OFFICIATE. IN THE END THOUGH, DID YOU KNOW THE NUMBER 1 REASON FOR OFFICIALS TO NOT RETURN TO OFFICIATE GAMES IS PARENTS? WEBSITES LIKE OFFSIDE ON FACEBOOK DO ALL SPORTS NOT JUST SOCCER AND IT HIGHLIGHTS THIS, SHOWS THAT OFFICIALS FOR ALL SPORTS ARE DOWN AND THERE ARE HUGE HOLES THAT NEED TO BE FILLED AND THE BIGGEST REASON FOR THAT IS PARENTS AND THE COMPLAINING? SINCE YOU PROB DONT DO A TON OF THIS AND DONT DO IT FOR ANY SPORT NATIONALLY YOU PROB DONT SEE OR GET THIS INFO, BUT OF THOSE THAT LEAVE THAT IS THE NUMBER 1 REASON FOR IT. NOT THE LOW PAY(AND IF YOU THINK YOU GET PAID ENOUGH AFTER EVERYTHING YOU PAID JUST TO DO THIS AND THE TAXES YOU PAY IN FOR BEING AN INDEPENDENT CONTRACTOR) I WOULD SUGGEST YOU LET ME KNOW HOW YOU ARE MAKING SO MUCH MONEY WITH IT, NOT EVEN THE TIME IT TAKES TO DO THE JOB, IT IS LITERALLY THE PARENTS THAT DRIVE PEOPLE OUT OF IT AND IF YOU THINK WE ARE GOING TO HAVE MUCH HELP WITH THE YOUNGER GENERATION THAT DOESNT HAVE THE THICK SKIN OF THE OLDER YOU ARE SADLY MISTAKEN AND THAT HOLE WITH NOT HAVING ENOUGH OFFICIALS HAS GROWN THROUGH THE YEARS. GOOD LUCK WITH IT AND I HOPE TO NEVER DO IT AGAIN.

 

 

Sid Mason 

RESPONDING ABOVE IN CAPS SO YOU KNOW MY ANSWERS

 

 

Edited February 20, 2023 by cobrakid8

[Mason422]

9 minutes ago, cobrakid8 said:

RESPONDING ABOVE IN CAPS SO YOU KNOW MY ANSWERS

 

 

That was very hateful and not helpful a  single bit in my opinion. 

see I don’t hide behind a user name so I welcome you to come and find me at a tourney so you can tell me that “I suck” as you said above. Not sure why you would assume I suck though ha ha. But, heck if I screw up I will own it.  Just so you know though you are contradicting yourself.  Remember I am not paid well and it’s a part time job as you stated so you should be ok with whatever I call according to your comments lol  

as far as officials not wanting to get better. I call matches with folks all of the time who misapplies the rules and I won’t dime them out here. 
 

You have made a lot of assumptions about me, my abilities and experience level. I would very much welcome you to come and have a constructive conversation with me at the state tourney this weekend. I bet we could come to a mutual understanding of each others point instead of being a tough guy on the internet. 

bottom line if you get paid to do a task as low pay as it may be others should have a reasonable expectation that the job is done correctly. I just don’t understand the hostility towards my post. What’s the problem with wanting people to be better at their job?

[coachpeck]

I've made a document that has the steps to become a TN TSSAA ref.

I won't get into any arguments here, but thought this resource would be good to post around to recruit more refs.   Feel free to share with graduating seniors and ex-wrestlers that might be interested.

Good luck to everyone (including the refs) at State.

Edited February 20, 2023 by coachpeck

[Mason422]

3 minutes ago, coachpeck said:

I've made a document that has the steps to become a TN TSSAA ref.

I won't get into any arguments here, but thought this resource would be good to post around to recruit more refs.   Feel free to share with graduating seniors and ex-wrestlers that might be interested.

Good luck to everyone (including the refs) at State.

That’s great and yes best of luck to everyone this weekend. 

[cobrakid8]

48 minutes ago, Mason422 said:

That was very hateful and not helpful a  single bit in my opinion. 

see I don’t hide behind a user name so I welcome you to come and find me at a tourney so you can tell me that “I suck” as you said above. Not sure why you would assume I suck though ha ha. But, heck if I screw up I will own it.  Just so you know though you are contradicting yourself.  Remember I am not paid well and it’s a part time job as you stated so you should be ok with whatever I call according to your comments lol  

as far as officials not wanting to get better. I call matches with folks all of the time who misapplies the rules and I won’t dime them out here. 
 

You have made a lot of assumptions about me, my abilities and experience level. I would very much welcome you to come and have a constructive conversation with me at the state tourney this weekend. I bet we could come to a mutual understanding of each others point instead of being a tough guy on the internet. 

bottom line if you get paid to do a task as low pay as it may be others should have a reasonable expectation that the job is done correctly. I just don’t understand the hostility towards my post. What’s the problem with wanting people to be better at their job?

that was completely helpful, sorry you just wont actually learn or become better from it. But again as i stated and will state again, your entire job as a parent is to be there for them, they get off the mat you screaming or yelling IS NOT HELPFUL AND MAKES NO CHANGES, you tell him or her good job, you are proud of them and to keep working hard, not fight with refs or even get into arguments with them.

 

I have made no assumptions on it you abilities or experience EXCEPT to know you have not done this at a high level, talking college or finals matches at state tournament or been an assignor for referees or been a region liason. If I am wrong about that I will gladly admit that, but the way treating referees and acting like its in our best interest to engage parents, I know you arent high level because none of those i do know will engage a parent, you are more than welcome to ask those that have went as TSSAA to referee at NCAA tournaments and they will tell you they will not and do not engage with parents. I also am not acting a tough guy, think more that you are acting a parent that their son didnt get a call sometime and not as a referee, but unlike you I have no bias, my son didnt wrestle and until I was a referee I would moan and complain like most parents when i didnt think they got a call, now i just sit back and enjoy what is happening no matter if wrestling, soccer, football, or any other sport because in the end I'm just glad to be alive to watch it and enjoy it. 

 

As far as treating a job as a job and doing your best, again that is what 99.9% of those i ever worked with did, if you ever hear a ref on purpose not, you need to be talking with your region guy in charge of referee's to have that taken care of. If not you have not done the sport any favors at all, I held my fellow referees to a high standard, heck I even had a few games my oldest was my center and me as assistant, we bounce back and forth on ideas to be better, if I am a ref and see another make mistakes, I will come to them and see what they saw that I didn't, the issue is when it becomes confrontational and that's the issue with parents, that is what it becomes and once one referee allows that its what ends up happening to other referees down the line and one of those might just end up quiting, we end up with much of that and you will be doing your own sons matches because there wont be enough to do it. You wont see me there this weekend because I no longer care that much about wrestling as I used to, so I'm not driving up to the cow palace, but I will post my name below and you are welcome to come find me sometime if down in the Soddy Daisy area, I've been on here a very long time so you could have searched and found it very easily as I was helping coach and ref before your son ever wrestled and prob was born. 

Good luck to all the kids this weekend and hopefully all of them can return home safe and sound!

 

Also thank you for your service AND continued service with our military!

 

Doug Benton C/O 99

 

Edited February 20, 2023 by cobrakid8

[cbg]

3 hours ago, cobrakid8 said:

https://www.becomeareferee.com/tennessee/#:~:text=Candidates must be 18 years,referee for the upcoming season.

 

This isn't counting the cost of actually taking the tests and getting your certification. They already require a state meeting as well as local meetings and those you aren't getting paid for. So when are parents going to start fronting that money for referee's to be able to attend? I mean I am not driving myself up to Nashville, paying my own hotel and staying a few days and having to PAY for the opportunity to do that LOL. I mean I already pay a fee to even become a referee in TN, to have a background check ran and also for the certification. All said and done before I even start I'm 300-400 in the hole.  I will also say, I made a lot more money when I was doing soccer for select and not schools. My oldest was a soccer official also with middle and high and he thought about doing other sports but in the end he stuck for years with just soccer because they are down so many referee's in all sports that he would have 4-5 offers for games at the same time and could pick and choose those he wanted to actually work. I enjoyed doing wrestling for the time I did it, but make no mistake about it, I only did it because I absolutely love this sport, it ended up being time away from my own family and that is what you are asking from these officials but than also complaining about them and the calls they make you do not agree with. My oldest finally quit and went with a regular job and my youngest who is 14 now has asked about doing it also(soccer allows 13 year olds to get their certs) however that also means I will have to do it again because someone has to drive him there and back and I'm not going through the trouble again, not even worth it.

If someone makes the conscious decision not to attend the preseason camp that is perfectly fine.  The only repercussions would be that they would not be allowed to officiate the state tournament series.  Those officials that elect to attend the camp would automatically be placed on a list to officiate the state tournament series but are not guaranteed any automatic appointment.  I would hope that all of the wrestling officials would want to work to get better at their craft even if it did cost a few bucks.  The shameful part is when the coaches and kids are working harder than the officials.  But then again, no harm and no foul if an official decides not to attend a camp conducted by some of the best high school wrestling officials in the USA. 

[cobrakid8]

51 minutes ago, cbg said:

If someone makes the conscious decision not to attend the preseason camp that is perfectly fine.  The only repercussions would be that they would not be allowed to officiate the state tournament series.  Those officials that elect to attend the camp would automatically be placed on a list to officiate the state tournament series but are not guaranteed any automatic appointment.  I would hope that all of the wrestling officials would want to work to get better at their craft even if it did cost a few bucks.  The shameful part is when the coaches and kids are working harder than the officials.  But then again, no harm and no foul if an official decides not to attend a camp conducted by some of the best high school wrestling officials in the USA. 

I mean to me my goal would be to be at the biggest event TSSAA holds for a referee and that being state. I would like to know the number of those that actually do not attend but go throughout the rest of the year being a referee. Also on that it does take time and money to actually be an official, which kind of sucks for someone that does the job for the love of the sport, I've known none that do it as the majority career and that is with some friends that do football-Fall, wrestling-winter, and soccer in the spring, but even with all that they still held a regular job. Now as far as making a conscious decision to be there or not, is different than do you know those that do not attend might not have a choice? Maybe they travel for their job and the one time they hold this preseason camp they are sent by their actual work that pays the bills out of town, or maybe they have a kid in another sport or in locals position multiple other kids that are in other sports, bet hey lets prioritize missing their event so I can go to this preseason ref clinic for a job I literally sign up for because I love the sport. You guys really make it easy on the choices I made to no longer do any of it, I mean I cannot find the fee's right now for tournaments like sectionals and such where you can be there 12 hours in the day but like the old days make $140-150. I mean that 12.50 is really worth it, plus my time to drive there and back any gas I use AND the taxes I end up paying to the IRS for it. I mean one season I worked in soccer I think I made a total of 600 after paying everything for my cert and the fee to do the job for the insurance and such. I mean I ended up just doing select tournaments and had a better time, I was put up into a pretty nice hotel, they also gave me per diem for meals and paid me mileage. Had 1 parent want to use some language i didn't appreciate(started with a F and you) after their kid came in spikes up and took out another, they got to watch their kid from the parking lot in their car. I also went and watched my oldest(who was 13 at the time way back as he's 22 now) and he did his first game and a few parents were all over him with off-side calls(not agreeing and such with his calls as he was not center but an AR on parents side). They didn't much appreciate when I started on their own kids when they had a bad touch and lost possession or just made a boneheaded play. After quite a few years of doing some high level games he decided not to come back to it after Covid hit and suspended most sports, because there wasn't enough money in it at that time compared to his regular job and having to put up with parents and even some coaches. Asked him the other day if he wanted to go back through the class with me and I would do it with him and his younger brother, he said no way, wasn't worth it. For a 13 year old kid the money he could make was really good, but older you get and you get a real job, it's really a balance between the love of the game or the aggravation of it all.

 

Also by the way I love how everyone here thinks there are right and wrong calls, but yet we have seen some videos posted by others with slams and such and has differing opinions from EVERYONE on here on if the call was correct or not, I mean I thought parent's knew it all and that is with video assistance?  Also I love when a call in college is made and people do not agree with it, heck I have seen challenges thrown and thought 100% the call was wrong and it not be overturned and 100% the call was right and the call was overturned, I guess we really need to start getting some robots ready!

Edited February 20, 2023 by cobrakid8

[cbg]

21 hours ago, cobrakid8 said:

I mean to me my goal would be to be at the biggest event TSSAA holds for a referee and that being state. I would like to know the number of those that actually do not attend but go throughout the rest of the year being a referee. Also on that it does take time and money to actually be an official, which kind of sucks for someone that does the job for the love of the sport, I've known none that do it as the majority career and that is with some friends that do football-Fall, wrestling-winter, and soccer in the spring, but even with all that they still held a regular job. Now as far as making a conscious decision to be there or not, is different than do you know those that do not attend might not have a choice? Maybe they travel for their job and the one time they hold this preseason camp they are sent by their actual work that pays the bills out of town, or maybe they have a kid in another sport or in locals position multiple other kids that are in other sports, bet hey lets prioritize missing their event so I can go to this preseason ref clinic for a job I literally sign up for because I love the sport. You guys really make it easy on the choices I made to no longer do any of it, I mean I cannot find the fee's right now for tournaments like sectionals and such where you can be there 12 hours in the day but like the old days make $140-150. I mean that 12.50 is really worth it, plus my time to drive there and back any gas I use AND the taxes I end up paying to the IRS for it. I mean one season I worked in soccer I think I made a total of 600 after paying everything for my cert and the fee to do the job for the insurance and such. I mean I ended up just doing select tournaments and had a better time, I was put up into a pretty nice hotel, they also gave me per diem for meals and paid me mileage. Had 1 parent want to use some language i didn't appreciate(started with a F and you) after their kid came in spikes up and took out another, they got to watch their kid from the parking lot in their car. I also went and watched my oldest(who was 13 at the time way back as he's 22 now) and he did his first game and a few parents were all over him with off-side calls(not agreeing and such with his calls as he was not center but an AR on parents side). They didn't much appreciate when I started on their own kids when they had a bad touch and lost possession or just made a boneheaded play. After quite a few years of doing some high level games he decided not to come back to it after Covid hit and suspended most sports, because there wasn't enough money in it at that time compared to his regular job and having to put up with parents and even some coaches. Asked him the other day if he wanted to go back through the class with me and I would do it with him and his younger brother, he said no way, wasn't worth it. For a 13 year old kid the money he could make was really good, but older you get and you get a real job, it's really a balance between the love of the game or the aggravation of it all.

 

Also by the way I love how everyone here thinks there are right and wrong calls, but yet we have seen some videos posted by others with slams and such and has differing opinions from EVERYONE on here on if the call was correct or not, I mean I thought parent's knew it all and that is with video assistance?  Also I love when a call in college is made and people do not agree with it, heck I have seen challenges thrown and thought 100% the call was wrong and it not be overturned and 100% the call was right and the call was overturned, I guess we really need to start getting some robots ready!

Regardless of one's profession or side hobbies that bring in a few extra dollars there will always be extenuating circumstances that prevent someone from attending the camp.  That's perfectly fine and maybe the camp could be done in Middle/West Tennessee one weekend and then move to East Tennessee the following weekend.  My goal is to stop making excuses and actually get something done that helps with training the officials.  

[cobrakid8]

36 minutes ago, cbg said:

Regardless of one's profession or side hobbies that bring in a few extra dollars there will always be extenuating circumstances that prevent someone from attending the camp.  That's perfectly fine and maybe the camp could be done in Middle/West Tennessee one weekend and then move to East Tennessee the following weekend.  My goal is to stop making excuses and actually get something done that helps with training the officials.  

one thing could be TSSAA actually covering the costs for all participants and maybe provide a stipend for the gas to get there. Gas is crazy expensive and if as you said they don't make one camp in west, one in middle and one in east, maybe a little fuel money would be a help. I mean again having done all this before, the pay is ok until you start taking into account the driving to and from the wear and tear on the car and the taxes you have to pay in the backhalf which means you usually have to hire an accountant and pay them to file the taxes unless a family member is one and does it for you :).  Can't really do anything about the circumstances of someone making it or not, unless I literally know someone just didn't want too I cannot fault them for not making it, we all have real jobs and most of us have kids doing other things, that's the one thing I liked about being an official and that was setting my own schedule so I could still be there for my own kids while also being there for those wrestling. 

 

 Also, we have pro referee's that everyone and their mother STILL complain about being wrong, they get crazy amounts of training and they are paid BIG bucks to do the job as their career. Maybe everyone needs to start understanding that maybe the parents or coaches are sometimes wrong and that officials are human and can make mistakes that sometimes are made in a quick second and cannot be changed, they just have to learn from it and get better, but perfection will never happen!

[TotallynotLEO]

Didn't read all of it,  saying that up front. 

I did read enough though. 

People are allowed to have an opinion, even parents. Saying they should put on the stripes is just a poor attempt to shut down opposing opinions.  

Do you have to be a cop to have an opinion on them? 

How about the military,  you only get to voice an opinion if you've signed up. Is that fair? 

See where this is going? 

Refs are human,  they make mistakes. I give them the benefit of the doubt most times... but not every time.  

Saw a kid at sectionals lose by 1. Ref called illegal move on a 3/4 Nelson from a sprawl position. That's unacceptable. 

At regions,  ref missed a locked hands call,  a really bad locked hands call, on kid trying to switch.  But the ref was on the other side of the kid and couldn't see it. I understand.  

One ref at Halls Vandergriff duals allowed a full can opener, for 30 seconds.  That's dangerous and fully unacceptable.  Had a talk with other ref over that.  He agreed it was illegal.  

Bearden preseason,  New ref in training under an experienced ref. Big experienced kid running a guillotine from cross body ride. Experienced ref had turned away to help another ref for a second.  New ref didn't know what was coming maybe but the kids shoulder got ripped out. Ref was new but I doubt that's any consolation to the kid with a torn labrum. 3 other kids left on a stretcher that day.  

Point is, there's degrees to this  like anything else. What we demand is that they keep kids safe. We strongly desire that they keep it fair as best they can.  

[cobrakid8]

48 minutes ago, TotallynotLEO said:

Didn't read all of it,  saying that up front. 

I did read enough though. 

People are allowed to have an opinion, even parents. Saying they should put on the stripes is just a poor attempt to shut down opposing opinions.  

Do you have to be a cop to have an opinion on them?       Do you yell at them and tell them they suck if you don’t agree with them? Let me know if you do and how well that works for you! 

How about the military,  you only get to voice an opinion if you've signed up. Is that fair?       Yeah that’s completely fair, with military I keep my trap shut except to tell them thanks for your service, I don’t know all that much about the military and their rules and regulations, I mean I might guess a few but I don’t have the actual experience to tell them what they are doing wrong! 

See where this is going? 

Refs are human,  they make mistakes. I give them the benefit of the doubt most times... but not every time.  

Saw a kid at sectionals lose by 1. Ref called illegal move on a 3/4 Nelson from a sprawl position. That's unacceptable. 

At regions,  ref missed a locked hands call,  a really bad locked hands call, on kid trying to switch.  But the ref was on the other side of the kid and couldn't see it. I understand.  

One ref at Halls Vandergriff duals allowed a full can opener, for 30 seconds.  That's dangerous and fully unacceptable.  Had a talk with other ref over that.  He agreed it was illegal. 
 

 did the referee have a discussion with said referee to let him know he missed something and maybe explain it? If not was a big miss by the referee you did talk too.

Bearden preseason,  New ref in training under an experienced ref. Big experienced kid running a guillotine from cross body ride. Experienced ref had turned away to help another ref for a second.  New ref didn't know what was coming maybe but the kids shoulder got ripped out. Ref was new but I doubt that's any consolation to the kid with a torn labrum. 3 other kids left on a stretcher that day.  

Wow, I’m glad that an experienced referee is a mind reader and also clairvoyant. I mean was this a split second thing because I feel it prob was and not sure any referee could have saved the kid from getting hurt. Pretty much just like one that does and illegal slam and the kid gets hurt, is the referee responsible for that also? 

Point is, there's degrees to this  like anything else. What we demand is that they keep kids safe. We strongly desire that they keep it fair as best they can.  
 

The point and just like the answers from above, just because you have wrestled doesn’t mean you understand or know how to referee a wrestling match, just like you not being in the military makes it where you are not able to question what takes place in the military. Heck you can question a doctor and the decision they have made but until you have the expertise necessary to do that job, you can question them but it doesn’t mean you are right and an opinion can be wrong just like anything else out there, just because it’s an opinion doesn’t mean it’s right. Back when I was actually doing work as a ref I always strived to do better and to learn everytime I was on mat or on the pitch. I have had referees come over and give some helpful advice and make me better. I’ve even said I will talk to coaches and did, in soccer the laws allow coaches to speak for their players but not parents, the parents entire job is to be there for their kid. Just like Saturday when I watched a referee award a point at the end of regulation in a tied match after a kid said an obscenity. I watched the coach talk to the referee pretty controlled and asked about what happened and try and get an answer to what all happened and to make his case it should not have been called. Just imagine if that was a parent as I saw some up in the stands all pissed off and ready to chew someone’s head off. Sorry, lots of parents cannot control their tempers and when it comes to “protecting” their kids because a call didn’t go their way they have even gotten physical. I’ve seen entire gyms emptied so a game could be finished and I’ve been a part of an entire field be sent to the cars to watch from there because parents couldn’t control themselves. A warning was given to the coach to get his parents under control and it continued and the match would either be abandoned or the parents could leave. Sorry, but parents have ran off many officials and in the end it’s cost their kids more than if they would have just sat down and enjoyed their kids playing a sport they love! So yeah, I think if you want to think of yourself knowing the rules of wrestling you should have the actual experience and knowledge by doing the job! Again, I’ve never done your job, but am I welcome to come tell you what you are doing wrong with it? I mean it’s a simple question, you get paid money for it, so can I walk in with no experience but maybe hearing about the job and tell you how wrong you are with decisions you make in it? 

Answers are above. 

Edited February 22, 2023 by cobrakid8

[soms2]

On 2/20/2023 at 12:08 PM, coachpeck said:

I've made a document that has the steps to become a TN TSSAA ref.

I won't get into any arguments here, but thought this resource would be good to post around to recruit more refs.   Feel free to share with graduating seniors and ex-wrestlers that might be interested.

Good luck to everyone (including the refs) at State.

Josh,

 Not looking bad in those stripes as you add that well deserved gray hairs.

If I were back into coaching, I’d appreciate you making the calls oh friend. You know wrestling