Why is any private in DI?

[Huh?]

Two separate philosophical questions about private schools.

Please respond to either or both.

 

 

Why would any private school be in existence and not give financial aid?

 

 

My bet is that most privates schools, religious or secular, exist in order to educate children in the values and principles that the school uphold, according to its mission statement. The mission more than likely does not state that "only children who can afford it" will be given access to this education. Most private schools DO offer some sort of "aid" , whether it is formal or informal, direct or work-study, tuition remission or secret benefactors paying, in order to include a precentage of children whose families can not afford it otherwise. Aid is good for the school, good for the student body, good for the educational process. It keeps the school from becoming an exclusive club, allows children to learn from diversity, and teaches them how to live in the "real world".

[Huh?]

Second question:

 

Why would any private school offer aid, but discriminate against athletes?

 

Why would the families of athletes not be given the opportunity to recieve aid? Why would a private school seeking to carry out its mission, which more than likely includes a direct or indirect reference to "integrity", say "we teach and live with integrity, but if your child participates in athletics, you may not receive financial aid." It seems inconsisent, but that is what many DI privates apparently are doing by remaining in DI.

 

I just don't get it and I wish some DI private school folks could shed some light here.

Edited February 27, 2005 by Huh?

[necvol]

Two separate philosophical questions about private schools. 

Please respond to either or both.

Why would any private school be in existence and not give financial aid?

My bet is that  most privates schools, religious or secular,  exist in order to educate children in the values and principles that the school uphold, according to its mission statement.  The mission more than likely does not state that "only children who can afford it" will be given access to this education.  Most private schools DO offer some sort of "aid" , whether it is formal or informal, direct or work-study, tuition remission or secret benefactors paying, in order to include a precentage of children whose families can not afford it otherwise.  Aid is good for the school, good for the student body, good for the educational process.  It keeps the school from becoming an exclusive club, allows children to learn from diversity, and teaches them how to live in the "real world".

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Most, if not all, private schools do offer financial aid to non-athletes. The TSSAA won't allow a privite school to compete in Division-1 if they give aid to athletes. The reasons are obvious and IMO approperiate. The main reason some private schools do not go Division-II is because of the scheduling problems that would result. We (USJ) would have to travel to Memphis, Nashvile and East TN in order to play schools our size. Can you imagine a Baseball or Basketball travel schedule that would result.

Edited February 28, 2005 by necvol

[rigger101]

Most, if not all, private schools do offer financial aid to non-athletes. The TSSAA won't allow a privite school to compete in Division-1 if they give aid to athletes. The reasons are obvious and IMO approperiate. The main reason some private schools do not go Division-II is because of the scheduling problems that would result. We (USJ) would have to travel to Memphis, Nashvile and East TN in order to play schools our size. Can you imagine a Baseball or Basketball travel schedule that would result.

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Ok, How about Goodpasture, David Libscomb, and others. IE the team from Knoxville that won AA Soccer last year.

Edited February 28, 2005 by rigger101

[Huh?]

Most, if not all, private schools do offer financial aid to non-athletes. The TSSAA won't allow a privite school to compete in Division-1 if they give aid to athletes. The reasons are obvious and IMO approperiate.

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Yo, I am not looking for a justification of why you are in DI--heard all that.

 

This is the issue:

 

It seems to me totally inconsistent for a school, like yours, to offer financial aid to all students without regard to creed or color, except to athletes. When a school takes that position I call that a lack of integrity.

 

Explain, not from an athletic standpoint why privates choose DI, but explain how a school justifies discrimination against a class of students (athletes).

[necvol]

Yo, I am not looking for a justification of why you are in DI--heard all that.

 

This is the issue:

 

It seems to me totally inconsistent for a school, like yours, to offer financial aid to all students without regard to creed or color, except to athletes.  When a school takes that position I call that a lack of integrity. 

 

Explain, not from an athletic standpoint why privates choose DI, but explain how a school justifies discrimination against a class of students (athletes).

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We really don't have much of a choice. The TSSAA rules basically force us to offer all students aid and not have an athletic program or, per your choice of words, "discriminate" against student/athletes. If USJ was located in Nashville, we might chose to go D-II. Located in Jackson we can not see a way to function in D-II. The travel would be a killer. How could we play a game in Nashville or Knoxville and get our student/athletes home in time to rest adequately for the next day's school? Not enough schools close to our size close enough to us.

 

You are trying to get me to admit we discriminate against student/athletes. My answer to you is we are only following the rules forced upon us by the TSSAA.

[VolunteerGeneral]

Huh?

 

I thought his answer was pretty clear the first time you asked.

[Huh?]

Nobody except your administration is forcing you to refuse aid to athletes!

TSSAA does not force a school to do this--- it is the administration of a school that , for what ever reason they choose to justify it, decides to not treat all its students equally!

My beef is that any school that gives aid----(basically most privates) should have bit the bullet and gone to DII. That of course is water under the bridge. But-----

I have no respect for a school that gives aid, except to a particular group of students.

Edited March 1, 2005 by Huh?

[Baldcoach]

Huh?,

 

I think you may not be listening to what you don't want to hear. I will try to put it another way, but this has been gone over again and again.

 

Almost all of the small D1 privates operate on a deficit budget. That means that tuition does not cover the cost of operations and the school relies on private donations just to keep the doors open. So, that is one way small privates try to let as many kids as they can attend...they keep tuition down as much as possible.

 

Because they are running deficit budgets, most small privates - and this is the key - can NOT afford to give any sort of financial aid, or can afford very little. That is the reason they are in D1 instead of D2. The small privates that can and do offer lots of financial aid all went D2.

 

So, while 1 or 2 students may get financial aid in the form of private or church based donations, the VAST majority (99%) do not and further the schools could not offer them aid even if they wanted. Thus, the students who are given aid are simply told that if they recieve aid in High School they can't play Varsity Athletics. We don't want to tell them that, but it seems to have been forced upon us.

 

THis is one point that the anti-private crowd or the misinformed often miss...there isn't any financial aid being given because there isn't any money to give.

[Bighurt]

Baldcoach is absolutely correct. For example at CPA, there is no budget item for financial aid.

[I Love HS Football]

All this talk about TSSAA forcing this and forcing that. What they should do is force all private schools to play in their own division. If that school does not have the money to give aid to atheletes or other students, so be. If they do, great. But they should be forced to play each other. TSSAA can not help that this private school works out of a deficit budget. Find more sponsors or up tuition. I understand there is definitely a problem with some issues about TSSAA, but this is not entirely TSSAA's fault here. Private schools whinned about not being able to play public schools, so TSSAA tried to make a way so they could without being totally unfair to public schools. Think about this, what if TSSAA said that all private schools could play in the same division as public schools and could offer kids in public school systems money to attend that school and recruit them for sports. How fair is that for public schools. Double-edged sword. No one comes out on top.

[Baldcoach]

All this talk about TSSAA forcing this and forcing that.  What they should do is force all private schools to play in their own division.  If that school does not have the money to give aid to atheletes or other students, so be.  If they do, great.  But they should be forced to play each other.  TSSAA can not help that this private school works out of a deficit budget.  Find more sponsors or up tuition.  I understand there is definitely a problem with some issues about TSSAA, but this is not entirely TSSAA's fault here.  Private schools whinned about not being able to play public schools, so TSSAA tried to make a way so they could without being totally unfair to public schools.  Think about this, what if TSSAA said that all private schools could play in the same division as public schools and could offer kids in public school systems money to attend that school and recruit them for sports.  How fair is that for public schools.  Double-edged sword.  No one comes out on top.

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Huh??

 

Am I groggy from lack of sleep or did that rambling rant make no sense?

 

From the little I was able to understand I think your idea of how this all happened is messed up. ALL the schools happily played together in one big TSSAA until some of the privates got good. THEN the TSSAA council (which is exclusively made up of Public ADs) formed DII for the Finanacial Aid giving privates and forced them to move. THEN some of the non-aid privates got good too, so the TSSAA put a 1.8 multiplier on them. THe privates have done nothing except try to do well in Football. So your original question is really misleading. It isn't that the privates are moving into D1...they have always been there with everyone else...it is that people Are trying to force them OUT when they have done nothing more than strive to become good. No evidence of any recruiting or cheating has ever been offered. So how fair is that for them? Perhaps you need to inform yourself a bit more before entering the debate...