Private schools unfair advantage?

[tnsddeveloper]

3rd: Multiplier was not designed to make privates go 0-30, but as a stop gap measure before the "nuclear option" of a total split happened.

So what is the complaint? They won. Not every private school is advancing statewide.

[cbg]

1st: I agree with the merit system.

2nd: I do not believe that the TSSAA will ever do it (yet I still hold out hope)

3rd: Multiplier was not designed to make privates go 0-30, but as a stop gap measure before the "nuclear option" of a total split happened.

 

You want to talk about a split so here we go:

1. Tennessee will not have a split before we know the final outcome of the BA vs TSSAA legal ramifications. BA has won in the past and IMO they will win the TSSAA's final appeal.

2. Some people feel that the TSSAA will have to file chapter 11 or 13 if BA forces the TSSAA to pay the legal fees. IMO BA will let the TSSAA off the hook on "SOME" of the legal fees but they will require the TSSAA to do other things and placing everyone back together in one division is something that will be forced.

3. If the public schools decided to leave the TSSAA or the TSSAA did file chapter 11 or 13 who would run the public school association? Would it be the Tennessee State Legislature?

4. Do you really feel that the State Legislature would keep the private schools from being in their association? Not only would they open the discrimination can of worms but the so called "rich private school parents" vote and contribute big $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ to politicans and as easy as that check is mailed to one politicans campaign fund it could also be routed to another politicans war chest. Yes the politicans may live in our small towns but their money comes from corporations and special interest groups that have students in private schools. Politicans live and die with the big money!!!!!!!

 

Let's all remember that the grass is not necessarly greener on the other side of the fence. We may have it better now than we would in the future.

Edited May 18, 2006 by cbg

[ctf33]

So what is the complaint? They won. Not every private school is advancing statewide.

 

Read my 1st post above. I was simply pointing out that urban based private schools have a large pool of students to draw from and that is an advantage. The multiplier is not the best answer to the problem. Merit system would be great if not that then split.

 

On a side note (with no malice intended) do you think that private schools really want a split knowing that they would then play each other and knock each other out of the play-offs? Seriously not trying to start a fight but wondering if it is a valid concern among private schools.

[tnsddeveloper]

You want to talk about a split so here we go:

4. Do you really feel that the State Legislature would keep the private schools from being in their association? Not only would they open the descrimination can of worms but the so called "rich private school parents" vote and contribute big $$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$$ to politicans and as easy as that check is mailed to one politicans campaign fund it could also be routed to another politicans war chest. Yes the politicans may live in our small towns but their money comes from corporations and special interest groups that have students in private schools. Politicans live and die with the big money!!!!!!!

Not to mention it gets back to the heart of BA's original claim of inhibition of free speech and discrimination by a state sponsored organization.

[sharptop]

any way the coin falls public school sports will be on the way out. everything will

be private and they want it that way.

[lazarus]

"do you think that private schools really want a split knowing that they would then play each other and knock each other out of the play-offs?"

 

 

i think this is a bigger concern than anyone wants to admit.

private schools are businesses,

and as businesses they must have clients, that is parents.

people who are going to pay for school want the best school experience possible for their kids.

competing for state titles comes under the heading of best school experience possible.

no matter how the private population at large may feel,

the people looking at the bottom line dont want a split.

and they dont want a reduction in the number of classes either.

it is a matter of dollars and sense.

[Grace Golden Eagles]

Do any states use a merit system for all sports? I have heard of a few that use it for just football.

[ctf33]

I have relatives that work at two private schools. It is a business. I am not saying that the only reason private schools exist is to win ball games. I know that is not the case, but I have not seen any private schools say they are dropping athletic programs because thats not what they are about, nor have I seen any private schools not emphasize the athletic accomplishments (as they should and I would expect them to.) But I know that one of the draws for a school is its athletic programs,along with other things. If a split occured and private schools began to knock each other out of play-offs wins/ tournament wins and championships a certain number of private schools would suffer.

I do not want to over step my bounds but many people said that Davidson Acad. move to Sumner Co. was due to the fact that they lost a number of kids to JPII. I can't help but think that athletics played a role in this decision. The parents that are paying money to these schools expect a total package academics, often times religiously based education, and quality extra-curricular activities. Nashville private education is particularly unique in that there are a large number of private schools, each of which competes for students. If I have not gone out on limb far enough already I suppose that I am about to...the multiplier actually helped private schools in that it allowed greater parity among them and increased the likelyhood of more teams going deeper into the play-offs/tournaments. I offer Goodpasture and Lipscomb as evidence of that in that both played in state championship games in football this year. If both were A or AA or AAA that could not have happened.

Edited May 18, 2006 by ctf33

[tnsddeveloper]

On a side note (with no malice intended) do you think that private schools really want a split knowing that they would then play each other and knock each other out of the play-offs? Seriously not trying to start a fight but wondering if it is a valid concern among private schools.

No malice taken. That is a very fair question that the privates must address. I do know for a fact there have been private, private meetings and discussions on that very topic - the topic of privates starting their own organization. It has included everything from what would be the travel schedules, what national body would recognize the organization, and how the would be able to pursue students to attend school.

 

I know that many publics would like to see that, but I think it would really hurt many publics. With the ability to offer financial aide to whoever and whenever, the better athletes will start migrating to the privates. I'm not saying there will be a mass exodus, but athletes (and academics) at low performing, overcrowded schools would jump at a chance to attend a private virtually free and play for strong programs - and getting stronger at that point too.

 

Let's not bite our noses to spite our face guys. Let's work that merit system in there ... because we all know this isn't just a private school issue. Magnets and open-zoners (Liberty, Maryville, Alcoa) are quite dominating is particular sports as are other publics that have "magic waterfountains" that grow athletes. For example, there is one installed in the girls bathroom in Shelbyville and boys bathroom at Riverdale.

[tnsddeveloper]

I have not seen any private schools say they are dropping athletic programs because thats not what they are about, nor have I seen any private schools not emphasize the athletic accomplishments (as they should and I would expect them to.)

This is no different than any other school public or private. Athletics make kids well rounded. Coupled with great academics, opportunities, non-secular educations - this is the reason why people choose to send their kids to private school. I haven't seen Riverdale, Maryville, or Shelbyville denounce their athletic programs.

 

But I know that one of the draws for a school is its athletic programs,along with other things. If a split occured and private schools began to knock each other out of play-offs wins/ tournament wins and championships a certain number of private schools would suffer.

They don't suffer in other states that have public and private splits.

 

I do not want to over step my bounds but many people said that Davidson Acad. move to Sumner Co. was due to the fact that they lost a number of kids to JPII. I can't help but think that athletics played a role in this decision.

I have a relative that works at Davidson Academy. More than 80% of their kids are Sumner Co. residents. They are moving closer to their base. I'm sure the JPII option played into that since they are in Sumner allowing kids to attend school closer to home ... and their campus rocks. I doubt sports had much if any to do with it. Davidson has had great success in athletics recently and in the past. Plus Catholic school is way different than Protestant ... and many consider that heavily.

 

The parents that are paying money to these schools expect a total package academics, often times religiously based education, and quality extra-curricular activities. Nashville private education is particularly unique in that there are a large number of private schools, each of which competes for students.

So by this definition ... wouldn't that make it harder for the privates to compete ... since it reduces their pool and reach as the public supporters so claim?

 

If I have not gone out on limb far enough already I suppose that I am about to...the multiplier actually helped private schools in that it allowed greater parity among them and increased the likelyhood of more teams going deeper into the play-offs/tournaments. I offer Goodpasture and Lipscomb as evidence of that in that both played in state championship games in football this year. If both were A or AA or AAA that could not have happened.

I do agree here. The idiocy of the multiplier backfired horribly. The publics literally thought they would multiply the privates into mediocrity or worse. Instead of applying the largest multiplier in the country ... they should have been coming up with a more equitable system for ALL - public, private, magnet, open-zoned.

[VolunteerGeneral]

Madison is in it`s third year of existence. Last fall the girl`s soccer team made it to the state tourney. The girls basketball team came within a last second missed layup of making it to the championship game. The boys soccer team is one win away from going to the state tournament. The girls tennis team lost 3-2 yesterday to USJ or they would have also been going to the state tournament. That`s not too bad for a third year school. Of course Madison is is a 100% magnet school.

[silverpie]

Do any states use a merit system for all sports? I have heard of a few that use it for just football.

 

The only all-sports merit systems I'm aware of are in the Chicago city schools (even though they're a public system, there are many different kinds of schools within it) and the state of Rhode Island.