Excuses

[Old Timer]

Certainly there are differences between public schools and private schools - some quantifiable, and some not. Sometimes the publics have better programs, sometimes the privates. Sometimes the privates have better facilities, sometimes not. There's too many variables in size, location, income, politics and a hundred other variables to define this argument to just a few points like so many people want to do. However, there are certainly more commonalities between the two types of schools than there are differences.

 

I've been on both sides of the argument. We were a public school family for the past 12 years. My oldest son is completely a public school child. My youngest son was a public school student until this year, when we moved to another city due to my job. My kids have attended public schools with new buildings and technology, and public schools where the lockers are 50 years old, and the bathrooms reak of urine. But our choice was always based on the quality of the teaching, not necessarily the schools condition, and definitely not the football program. I don’t think very many parents make decisions as to where their children attend school based on a football program. Perhaps a few, but mostly not. Its almost always about academics and what environment parents want their children in. Society has taken religion, church and the Bible out of the public system, and some parents simply prefer their children in a more Christian environment than the public schools can provide. But don't attack them because of that choice.

 

For some reason private schools are attacked for their facilities. Well, don't blame parents who will take money out of their own pockets, while still having to pay taxes to support the public schools. If the argument is facilities and equipment, then its our elected officials who must take the brunt of the blame. They are the ones who directly control money to the public school systems.

 

Better roads, or better schools?? – an age old political question. At the state funding level, one direct correlation between the amount of money spent per child is how good are the roads in the state. The better the roads, the less money that goes to public schools – and Tennessee has some of the best roads in the nation. And at the local level, it’s the same political process. It’s the local County Commissioners or City Council who don’t properly fund the public schools. Don’t like your facilities, or want facilities like some private schools have?? Then don’t post a complaint here, post one with your local elected officials.

 

Hey, VG, how many years has JCM waited on public funding to renovate their facilities? To get upgrades, didn't the city finally turnover the day to day operations to Lane College in hopes it would be upgraded?

[oknative]

Hey, VG, how many years has JCM waited on public funding to renovate their facilities? To get upgrades, didn't the city finally turnover the day to day operations to Lane College in hopes it would be upgraded?

I agree completely. My son went to JCM his sophomore year. Other than the new schools, most of the JMCSS schools are in horrible shape. Speaking of bathrooms that reak of urine - Tigrett MS comes to mind. The City Council almost cancelled all athletic programs and arts due to a budget battle with the School Board a couple of years ago. Don't hold your breath for any changes any time soon.

[old24eagle]

1. It's crazy to think you wouldn't know the difference if the government funding was cut. That's just silly.

 

2. What makes you think privates have all the athletes??? Publics have athletes just like privates. I don't understand the uncoordinated remarks directed at public school athletes. There are a lot of coordinated young men that play ball for public schools. And do you think privates have more kids on their team??? MJCA dressed 16 players this year! How many do you think MTCS dressed?? How 'bout FC?? I don't know, but not 50! And they don't have as many to choose from as their competition. How many does SC dress? How 'bout Watertown? The same amount as other 1-2A schools, public or private. In fact SC dresses considerably more than other 2A's. (just using SC as an example 'cause I know more about them than other teams )

 

3. OK, privates schools have 1 gold ball. What, do you think they should have; none? Are private schools supposed to not win anything???

 

4. There is no "we" in this, at least for my part. I'm not on the private school "side". I just call a spade a spade.

 

5. About the whining, would you whine if gov. funds were cut for publics, and kids had to make C's to play ball, and your enrollment was multiplied by 1.8 before you were classified? I think you would......And you expect privates to think all those things are fair???

 

6. (and most importantly) I still don't understand the supposed advantage for privates in "recruiting"! Please enlighten me. I am not being sarcastic, I promise. I just don't see it.

O.K. we get NO government funding at the public school I am at for sports, so if you get nothing and you cut out the NOTHING we get or subtract that 0 minus 0 = 0 last I checked, and usually you wouldn't even notice nothing - nothing I would think. I know you don't believe that but I don't care anymore . Arguing with you is Impossible because you believe your education from your glorious private school is superrior to everyone elses , and that even though we see first hand what is going on at publics and see parents who ONLY make enough money to pay their bills each month struggle to pay minimal fees to send their kids on field trips while you call them Ignorant and lazy for not finding someway to throw hundreds of thousands of dollars at their childs school. Guess what we don't all work monday through friday 9-5 and make 85,000 dollars a year most kids parents in public schools dont make half of that combined and they usually work overtime every week at one job and sometimes 2 jobs. Thats why they don't have time or money to throw around so we can even come close to having anything privates have.

If you want go ahead and do like everyone else and say BBBButt Alcoa , BBBButt Maryville , Fulton , Riverdale, Yeah great let them compete with private , but thats not what you want is it cause you can't beat them , you want to go up in the mountains and play small 1A and 2A schools that can't compete with you and scream oh It's fair the same time you wine because your spoiled rotten kid sprained his ankle in a hole in the field or got the wind knocked out of him because when he hit the groung he did'nt land on fluffy three inch deep bermuda and then he had to change in a classroom without a shower in it.

Edited December 5, 2006 by old24eagle

[oknative]

O.K. we get NO government funding at the public school I am at for sports, so if you get nothing and you cut out the NOTHING we get or subtract that 0 minus 0 = 0 last I checked, and usually you wouldn't even notice nothing - nothing I would think. I know you don't believe that but I don't care anymore . Arguing with you is Impossible because you believe your education from your glorious private school is superrior to everyone elses , and that even though we see first hand what is going on at publics and see parents who ONLY make enough money to pay their bills each month struggle to pay minimal fees to send their kids on field trips while you call them Ignorant and lazy for not finding someway to throw hundreds of thousands of dollars at their childs school. Guess what we don't all work monday through friday 9-5 and make 85,000 dollars a year most kids parents in public schools dont make half of that combined and they usually work overtime every week at one job and sometimes 2 jobs. Thats why they don't have time or money to throw around so we can even come close to having anything privates have.

If you want go ahead and do like everyone else and say BBBButt Alcoa , BBBButt Maryville , Fulton , Riverdale, Yeah great let them compete with private , but thats not what you want is it cause you can't beat them , you want to go up in the mountains and play small 1A and 2A schools that can't compete with you and scream oh It's fair the same time you wine because your spoiled rotten kid sprained his ankle in a hole in the field or got the wind knocked out of him because when he hit the groung he did'nt land on fluffy three inch deep bermuda and then he had to change in a classroom without a shower in it.

How about the public schools who do fund their football programs, should they be lumped in with the privates as a school "with money". Sounds like you believe this is a have and have not issue - have money or don't have money. So why don't we put all the funded programs in one division (regardless of whether they are public or private), and put all the unfunded programs in another division.

Edited December 5, 2006 by oknative

[defender25]

O.K. we get NO government funding at the public school I am at for sports, so if you get nothing and you cut out the NOTHING we get or subtract that 0 minus 0 = 0 last I checked, and usually you wouldn't even notice nothing - nothing I would think. I know you don't believe that but I don't care anymore . Arguing with you is Impossible because you believe your education from your glorious private school is superrior to everyone elses , and that even though we see first hand what is going on at publics and see parents who ONLY make enough money to pay their bills each month struggle to pay minimal fees to send their kids on field trips while you call them Ignorant and lazy for not finding someway to throw hundreds of thousands of dollars at their childs school. Guess what we don't all work monday through friday 9-5 and make 85,000 dollars a year most kids parents in public schools dont make half of that combined and they usually work overtime every week at one job and sometimes 2 jobs. Thats why they don't have time or money to throw around so we can even come close to having anything privates have.

If you want go ahead and do like everyone else and say BBBButt Alcoa , BBBButt Maryville , Fulton , Riverdale, Yeah great let them compete with private , but thats not what you want is it cause you can't beat them , you want to go up in the mountains and play small 1A and 2A schools that can't compete with you and scream oh It's fair the same time you wine because your spoiled rotten kid sprained his ankle in a hole in the field or got the wind knocked out of him because when he hit the groung he did'nt land on fluffy three inch deep bermuda and then he had to change in a classroom without a shower in it.

Sounds like to me you're just completely angry, and can't make any valid points because of it. You failed to answer any of my questions. If you think public schools don't get government funding, then you're just flat out wrong. Some get more than others, but that's because there are more people in some counties which directly translates into more tax money. But everything in every public school is paid for by tax-payers, including the tax-payers who send their kids to private schools. And that includes the sports programs. If you have a football team, then you have pads and helments that were paid for by tax money. 95% of public schools with football teams have their own fields, for which the land and goal posts were paid for with tax money. Then coaches who coach the teams, line the field, and cut the grass are paid with tax money. The footballs used in practice, and the refs who ref the games are paid for with tax money. Oh yeah, while I'm on this, there are more private schools without football teams than public schools without football teams. You know why? Because there are more private schools who can't afford football teams. You really won't like that fact; I can tell already. But it's true. Same for basketball. The gym that is played in, the basketballs that are used, the uniforms that are worn, the refs that call the game, and the coaches who coach it are all paid for with tax money. I could list many more examples. None of this is free. Yet you insist that if government funding was cut, you wouldn't know the difference??? Give me a break.

And another thing. I really don't appreciate you trying to make it look like I called any parent or child or family that is involved with the public school system "lazy" or "ignorant". That is not my opinion, and I never, ever said (or typed) that. If I really did, then find it, quote it, and I will apologize over and over. I have 8 cousins, all of which either graduated from, or are attending public schools. My uncle teaches history and coaches basketball for one of the smallest, most underfunded 1A high schools in the state. Trust me, I won't call names, but this one is as underfunded as they come And you know what? They have the same un-coordinated people there as they do at private schools. And they have the same lazy people there as they do at private schools. But they also have intelligent people and good athletes, just as private schools do. People are people. How much money they have makes no difference. And athletes are athletes; makes no difference how much money they or their parents have. I just have a problem with it when people who have athletic talent and work hard to perfect their skills are accused of buying wins or championships. There is no store at which you can purchase athletes, or work ethic, or anything of the sort. Smyrna didn't go to the football farm and purchase a state title team. Same with Fulton, Alcoa, or Maryville. But guess what? Neither did JCS. Because that isn't possible.

By the way, you STILL haven't answered my recruiting question......

[old24eagle]

Sounds like to me you're just completely angry, and can't make any valid points because of it. You failed to answer any of my questions. If you think public schools don't get government funding, then you're just flat out wrong. Some get more than others, but that's because there are more people in some counties which directly translates into more tax money. But everything in every public school is paid for by tax-payers, including the tax-payers who send their kids to private schools. And that includes the sports programs. If you have a football team, then you have pads and helments that were paid for by tax money. 95% of public schools with football teams have their own fields, for which the land and goal posts were paid for with tax money. Then coaches who coach the teams, line the field, and cut the grass are paid with tax money. The footballs used in practice, and the refs who ref the games are paid for with tax money. Oh yeah, while I'm on this, there are more private schools without football teams than public schools without football teams. You know why? Because there are more private schools who can't afford football teams. You really won't like that fact; I can tell already. But it's true. Same for basketball. The gym that is played in, the basketballs that are used, the uniforms that are worn, the refs that call the game, and the coaches who coach it are all paid for with tax money. I could list many more examples. None of this is free. Yet you insist that if government funding was cut, you wouldn't know the difference??? Give me a break.

And another thing. I really don't appreciate you trying to make it look like I called any parent or child or family that is involved with the public school system "lazy" or "ignorant". That is not my opinion, and I never, ever said (or typed) that. If I really did, then find it, quote it, and I will apologize over and over. I have 8 cousins, all of which either graduated from, or are attending public schools. My uncle teaches history and coaches basketball for one of the smallest, most underfunded 1A high schools in the state. Trust me, I won't call names, but this one is as underfunded as they come And you know what? They have the same un-coordinated people there as they do at private schools. And they have the same lazy people there as they do at private schools. But they also have intelligent people and good athletes, just as private schools do. People are people. How much money they have makes no difference. And athletes are athletes; makes no difference how much money they or their parents have. I just have a problem with it when people who have athletic talent and work hard to perfect their skills are accused of buying wins or championships. There is no store at which you can purchase athletes, or work ethic, or anything of the sort. Smyrna didn't go to the football farm and purchase a state title team. Same with Fulton, Alcoa, or Maryville. But guess what? Neither did JCS. Because that isn't possible.

By the way, you STILL haven't answered my recruiting question......

First of all I want to apologize to you for quoting you and making it seem as if I were talking directly to you. When I read your post I replied before I even seen your screenname and thought you were someone else I have been bickering with for quite some time now ....Sorry. BUT your WRONG about the tax money. I KNOW tax money doesn't pay for our helmets , pads , uniforms, field or field maintenance , it did not pay for our fieldhouse , lockers or goalposts. It paid for about HALF the cost of the Stadium , which consists of aluminum bleachers with a tiny mobile home building on top for a pressbox and seats about 300. Tax money doesn't buy our footballs or pay the refs , it didn't build or buy any equipment for the weight room either. Pay our coaches if you want to call that whoppin 1,200$ a year pay then Tax money does cover that. And if you think for one second that nicer fascilities , equipment and uniforms doesn't DRAW better athletes to your program your living in la la land. But once again my apologies for saying YOU said stuff that I know YOU did not.

[possum]

I WILL SAY AGAIN, other than the football field, bleachers, and one concession stand put in in 1978, everything at our football field has been paid by fundraisers, or ticket sales, just like the other two schools in the county. I don't know why this is still an issue, a multiplier was instated, this should be a mute issue. If recruiting is going on then it is not the privates fault, the Tssaa should be doing a better job of investigating. I think overall most public coaches are satisfied with the multiplier and are ready to move on.

[defender25]

First of all I want to apologize to you for quoting you and making it seem as if I were talking directly to you. When I read your post I replied before I even seen your screenname and thought you were someone else I have been bickering with for quite some time now ....Sorry. BUT your WRONG about the tax money. I KNOW tax money doesn't pay for our helmets , pads , uniforms, field or field maintenance , it did not pay for our fieldhouse , lockers or goalposts. It paid for about HALF the cost of the Stadium , which consists of aluminum bleachers with a tiny mobile home building on top for a pressbox and seats about 300. Tax money doesn't buy our footballs or pay the refs , it didn't build or buy any equipment for the weight room either. Pay our coaches if you want to call that whoppin 1,200$ a year pay then Tax money does cover that. And if you think for one second that nicer fascilities , equipment and uniforms doesn't DRAW better athletes to your program your living in la la land. But once again my apologies for saying YOU said stuff that I know YOU did not.

Apologies accepted old24eagle. No offense taken. Now just out of pure curiosity, because I have believed a misconception, where does the money come from for all this stuff? Is fundraising the big source of it? I know you can't speak for all public schools, for everybody raises money in different ways, but just speaking for the ones you know about. I just know that I went to a middle tennessee private school for 12 years (won't say which, but NOT FC!), and it wasn't because they had a good sports program. In fact, 1/3 of my graduating class had attended my school since 1st grade. But I did fundraisers out the wazoo, and many of my public school friends did not. I did participate in sports, and loved every minute of it, and wish every day I could do it again. All that to say, if it's not coming from tax money, then where? And the reason I say privates don't have an advantage in recruiting is because everything I see that privates do to raise their money, publics can do as well. They solicit local businesses to advertise through signs on their fences around their facilities (ex- baseball/softball fence/dugout, hang banners in their gym, on the fence around the football field), or have the PA announcer at a sporting event (or other event) promote their business. They sell cookie dough, magazines, candy bars, and things of that nature. They do bake sales and car washes. They might get support from a local doctor's office in turn for the coaches passing out flyers to the athletes or referring them to that office when there is an injury. These, and many other things, are the things that private schools do to raise their money for everything, including athletics. But the publics can do these things as well. And some do. It's just that I don't see very many doing it. Help me out. And again, no offense taken. This is a great subject to debate on a message board (in my opinion), and I'm glad this one's here

[oknative]

Tax money doesn't buy our footballs or pay the refs , it didn't build or buy any equipment for the weight room either.

I've been a referee in Tennessee for the past 4 years and have never been paid with anything other than a school check. Its possible that the money was fundraised by some outside organization and deposited with the school, but its always been school funds. Never have I been paid with cash or a personal check

Edited December 6, 2006 by oknative

[defender25]

I've been a referee in Tennessee for the past 4 years and have never been paid with anything other than a school check. Its possible that the money was fundraised by some outside organization and deposited with the school, but its always been school funds. Never have I been paid with cash or a personal check

oknative, I'm in the same boat. I have been an official in TN for 3 years and have never been paid with anything other than a school check. Now on the other end of that, I also work at a bank, and know that fundraising monies are deposited all the time into accounts in the school's name. However, the account will not just be "Franklin County High School" (ex). It will be specific; "Franklin County Girls Softball Dugout Fund" (ex). And if you'll look on the check, more often than not the account name will be something to that effect. But I can vouche for the fact that the refs are paid with school monies.

[old24eagle]

I've been a referee in Tennessee for the past 4 years and have never been paid with anything other than a school check. Its possible that the money was fundraised by some outside organization and deposited with the school, but its always been school funds. Never have I been paid with cash or a personal check

Money is taken from either the gate , concessions , of previous games and placed into a Football account with the school. If it's the first game we just hope we raised enough cash over the summer or had some left over from last year in that account.

[old24eagle]

Apologies accepted old24eagle. No offense taken. Now just out of pure curiosity, because I have believed a misconception, where does the money come from for all this stuff? Is fundraising the big source of it? I know you can't speak for all public schools, for everybody raises money in different ways, but just speaking for the ones you know about. I just know that I went to a middle tennessee private school for 12 years (won't say which, but NOT FC!), and it wasn't because they had a good sports program. In fact, 1/3 of my graduating class had attended my school since 1st grade. But I did fundraisers out the wazoo, and many of my public school friends did not. I did participate in sports, and loved every minute of it, and wish every day I could do it again. All that to say, if it's not coming from tax money, then where? And the reason I say privates don't have an advantage in recruiting is because everything I see that privates do to raise their money, publics can do as well. They solicit local businesses to advertise through signs on their fences around their facilities (ex- baseball/softball fence/dugout, hang banners in their gym, on the fence around the football field), or have the PA announcer at a sporting event (or other event) promote their business. They sell cookie dough, magazines, candy bars, and things of that nature. They do bake sales and car washes. They might get support from a local doctor's office in turn for the coaches passing out flyers to the athletes or referring them to that office when there is an injury. These, and many other things, are the things that private schools do to raise their money for everything, including athletics. But the publics can do these things as well. And some do. It's just that I don't see very many doing it. Help me out. And again, no offense taken. This is a great subject to debate on a message board (in my opinion), and I'm glad this one's here

We do all of those same fundraisers ,Advertisement Banners are a big one probably what keeps us going.