TSSAA Officials

[wormy1]

For a referee to answer that more details may be needed and maybe events leading up to the situation. Was this face guarding? It is a good question.

All i know is.....Don't be so rough with her and get your hands out of her face...What are they tought to do..Hands up!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

[whistleblower]

I can only speak for myself and I'd say the majority of officials.......

 

PHargis, you are right that the game is for the kids and we greatly understand that. I will talk to a coach when he/she has something to say to me (asking about a foul, violation, or a general question) or when I need help from a coach about something. If we are having a problem with a player, if I tell the coach almost always he/she will take care of it before I have to. Many coaches love the two way communication. Bottom line, you ask nice, I reply nice!

 

Greenvillefan, I will talk to a head coach who is male, female, white, black, red, blue, etc.!! That is the best answer I can give you!

 

Wormy1, many referees use the "preventative officiating" in their ballgames. We will talk to the players and try to talk them out of fouling or doing something dumb. Things such as "keep your hands off" or "don't body up" makes a game go smoother. Many coaches and players like it when you let them know what is going on and will listen to you. However, you can only talk so much and when a player don't listen, you have no choice but blow the whistle

[atdenton]

let me ask the fans this, i am an official and i love to talk to players to keep them in the game. however, what do you do when the coach says quit talking to them and just blow the whistle. the game is going great but he wants to stop and call fouls all the time. i ask the coach why shouldn't i talk to them and his response to me is that it's not a learning process out there." what do you do as an official then? just asking

[PHargis]

I can only speak for myself and I'd say the majority of officials.......

 

PHargis, you are right that the game is for the kids and we greatly understand that. I will talk to a coach when he/she has something to say to me (asking about a foul, violation, or a general question) or when I need help from a coach about something. If we are having a problem with a player, if I tell the coach almost always he/she will take care of it before I have to. Many coaches love the two way communication. Bottom line, you ask nice, I reply nice!

 

Greenvillefan, I will talk to a head coach who is male, female, white, black, red, blue, etc.!! That is the best answer I can give you!

 

Wormy1, many referees use the "preventative officiating" in their ballgames. We will talk to the players and try to talk them out of fouling or doing something dumb. Things such as "keep your hands off" or "don't body up" makes a game go smoother. Many coaches and players like it when you let them know what is going on and will listen to you. However, you can only talk so much and when a player don't listen, you have no choice but blow the whistle

this is a very good reply and some very respectful and i think some very important responses. Your last paragraph is particularly insightful. i see why you might do that as you are just warning players what you are going to call which means to me there must be some gray areas in officiating especially in contact fouls and there are some, I think, that need to be cleaned up.

[PHargis]

this is a very good reply and some very respectful and i think some very important responses. Your last paragraph is particularly insightful. i see why you might do that as you are just warning players what you are going to call which means to me there must be some gray areas in officiating especially in contact fouls and there are some, I think, that need to be cleaned up.

I can only speak for myself and I'd say the majority of officials.......

 

PHargis, you are right that the game is for the kids and we greatly understand that. I will talk to a coach when he/she has something to say to me (asking about a foul, violation, or a general question) or when I need help from a coach about something. If we are having a problem with a player, if I tell the coach almost always he/she will take care of it before I have to. Many coaches love the two way communication. Bottom line, you ask nice, I reply nice!

 

This is a great answer and is one that is very reasonable. I can only give this response. There is an referee in Nashville that does as good as any official i have ever seen and is on top of the game with the crew he officiates with. He communicates before the game, very likable, and gives the appearance to everyone that the game is under control. He does the things you are suggesting and many times explains the fouls if they are controversal. Always has a smile and always anticipates problem calls with some explanation and looking the coach in the eye and ready to explain. He is uncanny. He hears the other side, nods his head and continues with the game. As you can imagine he has been around for a while and I don't know but I would suspect he has something to do with training officials also. There has been on some of these threads reference to coaches using foul language which I find very hard to believe but if it is so and that is the response you get, you have no choice butI would hope that there are rules on the conduct of coaches and players that cover that and they should be stringently upheld. It has no place in high school sports in my opinion. But communication does. That being said, civility it looks like is the name of the game and your comment on two way communication is a comment I also expected to hear but the bottom line hopefully has a little buffer in it also with a warning and I know it does in your case.

 

There are others which may go out of their way to be the opposite and for that matter there are some coaches the same way. This is an Association problem and one that can be resolved. You answered my comment as I knew you would and you very likely do very well. I didn't mean to sound confrontive on my first post and be one of the first posters in the history of T to be "Tee'd Up".

[whistleblower]

PHargis, you and I are having the same type conversation many of us would have in a ballgame. The only way you would get T'd would be if you got animated or very sarcastic!

 

There are really no grey areas. When I say "talk to players", it's basically just reminding them that you are there watching them. Especially post players! However, if at any time of the game, someone commits a foul, it is called! A foul is a foul! Like what is widely known, everyone wants to watch the kids play and if our talking to them helps them out then so be it.

 

And if a coach ever asked me to stop talking to his players, I would comply with his / her wishes! I have never had it happen before! If he/she wants fouls called, fouls would be called!

[PHargis]

PHargis, you and I are having the same type conversation many of us would have in a ballgame. The only way you would get T'd would be if you got animated or very sarcastic!

 

There are really no grey areas. When I say "talk to players", it's basically just reminding them that you are there watching them. Especially post players! However, if at any time of the game, someone commits a foul, it is called! A foul is a foul! Like what is widely known, everyone wants to watch the kids play and if our talking to them helps them out then so be it.

 

And if a coach ever asked me to stop talking to his players, I would comply with his / her wishes! I have never had it happen before! If he/she wants fouls called, fouls would be called!

Good conversation. Now I'll let someone else jump in. It's very likely conversations like this might diffuse some difficult situations that could be building up and is very healthy.

[HSsportfan]

Whistleblower,

I was at a game at the Union County Tourney this week and saw some very good officiating and some of the worst I have seen before. We had a player that was obviously being singled out by one ref and had two fouls called on her before the game barely got started. The coach sat her on the bench for the rest of the quarter and let her go back in for qtr 2 with instructions not to foul. As soon as she was in the game she was called for number 3. She looked over at her coach who was about 10 feet away and said "Coach, I promise I didn't foul her." This was not spoken loudly or aimed at the referee, she was just telling her coach that she was trying to do what she was told. People in the stands didn't know what she had said. The ref hears her tell her coach that and call a technical on her. This gives her four personals with only about 3 minutes playing time! Where do you draw the line? This player was only talking to her coach. Does the referee have the right to Tee up for private conversation? We later find out the ref is a relative of a former teammate that thinks she was wronged by losing playing time to this girl two years ago. How professional is that?

[utvols1]

I also officiate basketball, and I agree with what the other officials on this board have said 100%. Most of us as officials do not come in to the games with the mindset that we are going to call for one team or the other. We are as un-biased as we can possibly be. We dont get together and talk about who we want to win the game or who we are going to single out or anything like that...and most of us do it for the love of the game and for the kids. I think I speak for most of the guys who ref ball when I say its not at all about the money...For the small amount we do get paid we have to pay for gas, make sacrifices in our personal schedules, and listen to hundreds of critics that are up in the stands ever time we take the floor. I know that when I am out there on the floor I try to block out what everyone in the stands are yelling and focus on the game.

 

As far as talking to coaches goes,...if a coach comes to me in a RESPECTABLE manner and with a RESPECTABLE tone, I will talk to him with RESPECT. I dont like to give technical fouls but sometimes they are necessary when coaches dont go about things the right way. To me, and the guys i officiate with, we work hard and do our best, and understand that coaches are not going to like every call we make.What this whole issue boils down to is RESPECT...If I am treated with respect then I will show respect and work with the coaches, but if a coach is yelling and screaming and telling me how horrible I am...then things will get a little bit uncomfortable for them when they lose there standing priveledges and the other team gets 2 shots and the ball...like i said...if I am shown respect, I will show respect but if a coach isnt respectful...I have some motivation to remind him that he needs to show some...Its all about RESPECT

[PHargis]

This is a very good post as are all of the posts by officials. As you can see though there are some isolated events concering officiating that may be happening which are misunderstood. As you might undertand they might be even shaded some. The issue of incidential contact in the rules may not be being called consistantly thruout the state and for that matter even thru an Association. In some cases it has bordered on the extreme. Hand to hand combat away from the ball is sometimes allowed and where is the point of judgement and my question deals not only with post players but all players. As a point of clarity in the rules, is incidental contact called the same in boys and girls games or where does judgement enter the scene. I would hope judgement does enter in but for safely sake how is that generally looked at. I think i have asked too many questions in this post but the crux of this matter has to do with contact and the way it is looked at. And how do three referees reconcile it when each may be at different positions on the floor during the game and may look at it differently? This has got to be a gray area in the rules since even one post on here mentions if a coach mentions the game is not being called close enough, it might be adjusted but if it is adjusted, is it done so on both ends and how is that communicated?

[treeball]

My biggest question is why are alll 3 refs looking at the same thing instead of watching certain areas? Why does the ref at mid court call a foul under the basket on a blocked shot? How can a ref under the basket call goal tending? Many times I wish they would go back to two refs.

[utvols1]

My biggest question is why are alll 3 refs looking at the same thing instead of watching certain areas? Why does the ref at mid court call a foul under the basket on a blocked shot? How can a ref under the basket call goal tending? Many times I wish they would go back to two refs.

 

We each have areas to officiate, but in certain situations the official under the basket may have a blocked view of a call and in that case the trail official or center official may have to come in and make the call. The 3 man system is 200% better than the old 2 man crews. I have called basketball in both 2 and 3 man crews, and with 6 eyes instead of 4 on the floor, the games go much smoother and more of the fouls are called and less gets by uncalled. If you really want to see how a 3 man crew works go look around the tssaa website or nfhs site and see if you can find a guide on there. I know you can call the state and purchase a rules book, case book, and officials guide from the TSSAA office...They will send you the exact same books they send us when we register...