Consolidation of Marion County schools

[TheAmbassador]

Just now, sum1uno said:

You can’t convince no skillet slinger that bigger ain’t better. You should have learned that when Wendy left. 

Great minds...

[sum1uno]

Just now, TheAmbassador said:

Great minds...

[tradertwo]

1 hour ago, TheAmbassador said:

Great minds...

He beat me to the punch too.

[team69]

4 hours ago, tradertwo said:

This is a hot topic rlh, with proponents on both sides having "logical" arguments. In addition to logic and facts, I like to consider everything involved and how the facts affect everyone involved. Consolidation usually eliminates a few positions and condenses maintenance of facilities, while incurring large up front expenses and increasing busing expense into perpetuity. Long story short... into the foreseeable future the expenditures/savings are nullified. So why do it? Advocates argue diversity of course offerings and campus security, while those against counter with student performance and community involvement. If you want to stick to scientific findings, schools ranging from 600 to 900 students most effectively balance curriculum and optimizing student performance.

   What very few proponents of consolidation want to address is the effect of closing schools on the communities in which they are located, and the impact on individual students in outlying areas of the county. Boarding a bus every morning two hours before, and exiting two hours after school isn't considered... businesses dependent on localized activity isn't considered... school support by those same businesses and the community as a whole isn't considered, as well as other "small" issues made more difficult to monitor and police, such as truancy, abuse, bullying, ect…

   My personal viewpoint is that small rural schools offer security and individuality to the students that the large ones can't match. Diversity of curriculum is good on paper, but by percentages of student application's, it is more for propaganda than application. I would be much more comfortable sending my kid to a school on a bus driven by my neighbor, where the principal and most teachers were my classmates, and most of the students and their families are familiar to me. Also, even though the school system has no "official" affiliation with, nor duty to the community in which the school is located, I (personal opinion here) feel that our schools "owe" a gratitude to them for policing, servicing, and supporting the school. Last, but not least... those "positions" that proponents desire to eliminate are held (in majority) by good taxpaying county residents who depend on their jobs. If consolidation eliminates 9 positions (roughly $460,000.00), yet incurs an up front cost of 10 million for construction, and increases the transportation budget by $90,000.00 per year...well, you do the math.

I assume the cost of  a new HS is considerably more than a new Middle school. 40 % of Marions Population owns all the property. A wheel tax want even cover the transportation so if they decide to consolidate the property owners better get ready to start digging some jars up.

 

[9zo]

8 hours ago, tradertwo said:

This is a hot topic rlh, with proponents on both sides having "logical" arguments. In addition to logic and facts, I like to consider everything involved and how the facts affect everyone involved. Consolidation usually eliminates a few positions and condenses maintenance of facilities, while incurring large up front expenses and increasing busing expense into perpetuity. Long story short... into the foreseeable future the expenditures/savings are nullified. So why do it? Advocates argue diversity of course offerings and campus security, while those against counter with student performance and community involvement. If you want to stick to scientific findings, schools ranging from 600 to 900 students most effectively balance curriculum and optimizing student performance.

   What very few proponents of consolidation want to address is the effect of closing schools on the communities in which they are located, and the impact on individual students in outlying areas of the county. Boarding a bus every morning two hours before, and exiting two hours after school isn't considered... businesses dependent on localized activity isn't considered... school support by those same businesses and the community as a whole isn't considered, as well as other "small" issues made more difficult to monitor and police, such as truancy, abuse, bullying, ect…

   My personal viewpoint is that small rural schools offer security and individuality to the students that the large ones can't match. Diversity of curriculum is good on paper, but by percentages of student application's, it is more for propaganda than application. I would be much more comfortable sending my kid to a school on a bus driven by my neighbor, where the principal and most teachers were my classmates, and most of the students and their families are familiar to me. Also, even though the school system has no "official" affiliation with, nor duty to the community in which the school is located, I (personal opinion here) feel that our schools "owe" a gratitude to them for policing, servicing, and supporting the school. Last, but not least... those "positions" that proponents desire to eliminate are held (in majority) by good taxpaying county residents who depend on their jobs. If consolidation eliminates 9 positions (roughly $460,000.00), yet incurs an up front cost of 10 million for construction, and increases the transportation budget by $90,000.00 per year...well, you do the math.

Gotta admit I was for consolidation when I was younger, but now I see what each of these three schools mean to their communities. I'm amazed how the people of Whitwell came together to support their football team. Probably nothing short of a Russian invasion could have done it any better. You are correct when you say there are many pros and cons to this situation. I've been listening to people talk about this, with great passion, all week yet no one knows where the school would be built or how much it's going to cost. Would it open up new academic possibilities? Maybe. Some examples I've seen put forth, as a pro, are culinary arts and cosmetology, Calculus I and II, etc. I'm sure doing make-up and hair will be a popular choice but the other three, well...…………… On the athletics side the proponents argue that the new school would have new sports such as bowling, lacrosse, etc. All I can do is scratch my head on that one. Now, about the busing situation. It's all good if you live within five miles of the school but if you live on the mountains well your in for a long week. A large percentage of the proponents, I've seen commenting, will live within this five mile radius. Seems like the kids that will commute three hours per day are just casualties of consolidation. Lastly, and far from least, we have the great money issue. I saw one person comment, on social media today, that we should "max out" a wheel tax and rely on property taxes to make up the difference. OK, our sales tax is already "maxed out" and we're gonna have a "maxed out" wheel tax, and some level of increase to our already high property taxes. I guess I'll just have to wait and see which argument convinces me consolidation is the right thing to do. Maybe the fear one, "Our current schools are unsafe" or maybe the guilt trip one, "Don't you care about our children's future?" Time will tell.

[Batman]

Normally I read only, but this consolidation issue needs addressed forcibly. Here are facts for Marion county tax payers. SPHS burnt in 1964 & rebuilt from insurance compensation on the very same piece of property. The SPES burnt & rebuilt on the very same piece of property. All the students,parents & teachers adjusted to the loss realizing progress for each building project was forthcoming. 

The property that the current football field occupies was donated by the city. The practice field was donated by the city. The baseball field property was donated by Lodge Mfg. Both football field houses were Not financed by the county or school board. The upgrades at the softball & baseball fields were not financed by the tax payers or county school board.         

Now here are several disturbing facts for the tax payers.

Jasper has received 3 new schools since SPHS was built. Now the 4th is in the planning stages. Yes, the new school scheduled will replace the current school that was built years after SPHS. Reportedly JMS is a dump but no one has answered some common core questions! How did it get to be a dump years before it should have?  Who is responsible for the neglect of this building? What & where is the possible renovation estimate for the JMS? What known elementary, middle or high school has a 25 acre campus? 

The Jasper supporters are asking for 25 acres for the proposed Jasper Middle School. The request is also for a new football facility and lord only knows what else at a reported price of 22 Million Dollars. The Marion County School Board once owned 90 acres where the Jasper Elementary now sets. Acreage not used was reportedly given to the City of Jasper. The proposed new JMS 25 acre campus has to be purchased from some land owner. The City of Jasper reportedly will not give the property or any portion of it back to build the reportedly much needed school! 

An architect has provided a 40+ Million estimate for a consolidated high school. County sales tax is maxed, so that leaves only 1 avenue to get funding for either building project, much higher property taxes!  BTW, SPHS, now obviously the oldest school could use some updates but a major portion of the original tile flooring is in remarkably good condition for a 50+ year old! 

Some complain, the maintenance department is to blame for the poor condition of the JES. Huge and very important questions immediately surfaces, Why, How & Who is really responsible? It is glaringly obvious there is or has been a serious lack of accountability. 

As an avid SPHS supporter, I see the enrollment increases at South Pittsburg High School. The argument that parents are seeing the advantages of smaller schools is easily recognized.  

In closing, The importance of rivalries & athletics has been called into question. Rivalries are needed for successful athletic programs and vital to all schools. My class was a part of a very successful run. It was common for students to quit school & take jobs. Players often worked to pass only to stay in school just to play football or basketball. Three classmates became ineligible due to age, two of the three quit school after football season.  I had the pleasure of having breakfast with several members of my 1972 class Saturday at the Cracker Barrel. The 100+ 1972 class produced 3 doctors, many successful career professionals.  One doctor is known nationally as a top brain trauma physician specializing in blunt trauma deaths and Dean at Emory University.  I can proudly say, SPHS has, does and will continue to provide a quality education with a close family type atmosphere for students to be successful and have memories of close friends and often times great experiences & athletic achievements. 

Johnny Stone, GO PIRATES & GO VOLS

 

 

Edited December 11, 2018 by Batman

[tradertwo]

25 minutes ago, Batman said:

Normally I read only, but this consolidation issue needs addressed forcibly. Here are facts for Marion county tax payers. SPHS burnt in 1964 & rebuilt from insurance compensation on the very same piece of property. The SPES burnt & rebuilt on the very same piece of property. All the students,parents & teachers adjusted to the loss realizing progress for each building project was forthcoming. 

The property that the current football field occupies was donated by the city. The practice field was donated by the city. The baseball field property was donated by Lodge Mfg. Both football field houses were Not financed by the county or school board. The upgrades at the softball & baseball fields were not financed by the tax payers or county school board.         

Now here are several disturbing facts for the tax payers.

Jasper has received 3 new schools since SPHS was built. Now the 4th is in the planning stages. Yes, the new school scheduled will replace the current school that was built years after SPHS. Reportedly JMS is a dump but no one has answered some common core answers! How did it get to be a dump years before it should have?  Who is responsible for the neglect of this building? Where is the possible renovation estimate for the JES? What known elementary, middle or high school has a 25 acre campus? 

The Jasper supporters are asking for 25 acres for the proposed Jasper Middle School. The request is also for a new football facility and lord only knows what else at a reported price of 22 Million Dollars. The Marion County School Board once owned 90 acres where the Jasper Elementary now sets. Acreage not used was reportedly given to the City of Jasper. The proposed new JMS 25 acre campus has to be purchased from some land owner. The City of Jasper reportedly will not give the property or any portion of it back to build the reportedly much needed school! 

An architect has provided a 40+ Million estimate for a consolidated high school. County sales tax is maxed, so that leaves only 1 avenue to get funding for either building project, much higher property taxes!  BTW, SPHS, now obviously the oldest school could use some updates but a major portion of the original tile flooring is in remarkably good condition for a 50+ year old! 

Some complain, the maintenance department is to blame for the poor condition of the JES. Huge and very important questions immediately surfaces, Why, How & Who is really responsible? It is glaringly obvious there is or has been a serious lack of accountability. 

As an avid SPHS supporter, I see the enrollment increases at South Pittsburg High School. The argument that parents are seeing the advantages of smaller schools is easily recognized.  

In closing, The importance of rivalries & athletics has been called into question. Rivalries are needed for successful athletic programs and vital to all schools. My class was a part of a very successful run. It was common for students to quit school & take jobs. Players often worked to pass only to stay in school just to play football or basketball. Three classmates became ineligible due to age, two of the three quit school after football season.  I had the pleasure of having breakfast with several members of my 1972 class Saturday at the Cracker Barrel. The 100+ 1972 class produced 3 doctors, many successful career professionals.  One doctor is known nationally as a top brain trauma physician specializing in brunt trauma deaths and Dean at Emory University.  I can proudly say, SPHS has, does and will continue to provide a quality education with a close family type atmosphere for students to be successful and have memories of close friends and often times great experiences & athletic achievements. 

Johnny Stone, GO PIRATES & GO VOLS

 

 

I'd vote for you...

[team69]

2 hours ago, Batman said:

Normally I read only, but this consolidation issue needs addressed forcibly. Here are facts for Marion county tax payers. SPHS burnt in 1964 & rebuilt from insurance compensation on the very same piece of property. The SPES burnt & rebuilt on the very same piece of property. All the students,parents & teachers adjusted to the loss realizing progress for each building project was forthcoming. 

The property that the current football field occupies was donated by the city. The practice field was donated by the city. The baseball field property was donated by Lodge Mfg. Both football field houses were Not financed by the county or school board. The upgrades at the softball & baseball fields were not financed by the tax payers or county school board.         

Now here are several disturbing facts for the tax payers.

Jasper has received 3 new schools since SPHS was built. Now the 4th is in the planning stages. Yes, the new school scheduled will replace the current school that was built years after SPHS. Reportedly JMS is a dump but no one has answered some common core questions! How did it get to be a dump years before it should have?  Who is responsible for the neglect of this building? What & where is the possible renovation estimate for the JMS? What known elementary, middle or high school has a 25 acre campus? 

The Jasper supporters are asking for 25 acres for the proposed Jasper Middle School. The request is also for a new football facility and lord only knows what else at a reported price of 22 Million Dollars. The Marion County School Board once owned 90 acres where the Jasper Elementary now sets. Acreage not used was reportedly given to the City of Jasper. The proposed new JMS 25 acre campus has to be purchased from some land owner. The City of Jasper reportedly will not give the property or any portion of it back to build the reportedly much needed school! 

An architect has provided a 40+ Million estimate for a consolidated high school. County sales tax is maxed, so that leaves only 1 avenue to get funding for either building project, much higher property taxes!  BTW, SPHS, now obviously the oldest school could use some updates but a major portion of the original tile flooring is in remarkably good condition for a 50+ year old! 

Some complain, the maintenance department is to blame for the poor condition of the JES. Huge and very important questions immediately surfaces, Why, How & Who is really responsible? It is glaringly obvious there is or has been a serious lack of accountability. 

As an avid SPHS supporter, I see the enrollment increases at South Pittsburg High School. The argument that parents are seeing the advantages of smaller schools is easily recognized.  

In closing, The importance of rivalries & athletics has been called into question. Rivalries are needed for successful athletic programs and vital to all schools. My class was a part of a very successful run. It was common for students to quit school & take jobs. Players often worked to pass only to stay in school just to play football or basketball. Three classmates became ineligible due to age, two of the three quit school after football season.  I had the pleasure of having breakfast with several members of my 1972 class Saturday at the Cracker Barrel. The 100+ 1972 class produced 3 doctors, many successful career professionals.  One doctor is known nationally as a top brain trauma physician specializing in blunt trauma deaths and Dean at Emory University.  I can proudly say, SPHS has, does and will continue to provide a quality education with a close family type atmosphere for students to be successful and have memories of close friends and often times great experiences & athletic achievements. 

Johnny Stone, GO PIRATES & GO VOLS

 

 

Heard there was a famous Goat Herder that came from that class....Wonder what happened to him?

[FridayMainEvent]

13 hours ago, Batman said:

Normally I read only, but this consolidation issue needs addressed forcibly. Here are facts for Marion county tax payers. SPHS burnt in 1964 & rebuilt from insurance compensation on the very same piece of property. The SPES burnt & rebuilt on the very same piece of property. All the students,parents & teachers adjusted to the loss realizing progress for each building project was forthcoming. 

The property that the current football field occupies was donated by the city. The practice field was donated by the city. The baseball field property was donated by Lodge Mfg. Both football field houses were Not financed by the county or school board. The upgrades at the softball & baseball fields were not financed by the tax payers or county school board.         

Now here are several disturbing facts for the tax payers.

Jasper has received 3 new schools since SPHS was built. Now the 4th is in the planning stages. Yes, the new school scheduled will replace the current school that was built years after SPHS. Reportedly JMS is a dump but no one has answered some common core questions! How did it get to be a dump years before it should have?  Who is responsible for the neglect of this building? What & where is the possible renovation estimate for the JMS? What known elementary, middle or high school has a 25 acre campus? 

The Jasper supporters are asking for 25 acres for the proposed Jasper Middle School. The request is also for a new football facility and lord only knows what else at a reported price of 22 Million Dollars. The Marion County School Board once owned 90 acres where the Jasper Elementary now sets. Acreage not used was reportedly given to the City of Jasper. The proposed new JMS 25 acre campus has to be purchased from some land owner. The City of Jasper reportedly will not give the property or any portion of it back to build the reportedly much needed school! 

An architect has provided a 40+ Million estimate for a consolidated high school. County sales tax is maxed, so that leaves only 1 avenue to get funding for either building project, much higher property taxes!  BTW, SPHS, now obviously the oldest school could use some updates but a major portion of the original tile flooring is in remarkably good condition for a 50+ year old! 

Some complain, the maintenance department is to blame for the poor condition of the JES. Huge and very important questions immediately surfaces, Why, How & Who is really responsible? It is glaringly obvious there is or has been a serious lack of accountability. 

As an avid SPHS supporter, I see the enrollment increases at South Pittsburg High School. The argument that parents are seeing the advantages of smaller schools is easily recognized.  

In closing, The importance of rivalries & athletics has been called into question. Rivalries are needed for successful athletic programs and vital to all schools. My class was a part of a very successful run. It was common for students to quit school & take jobs. Players often worked to pass only to stay in school just to play football or basketball. Three classmates became ineligible due to age, two of the three quit school after football season.  I had the pleasure of having breakfast with several members of my 1972 class Saturday at the Cracker Barrel. The 100+ 1972 class produced 3 doctors, many successful career professionals.  One doctor is known nationally as a top brain trauma physician specializing in blunt trauma deaths and Dean at Emory University.  I can proudly say, SPHS has, does and will continue to provide a quality education with a close family type atmosphere for students to be successful and have memories of close friends and often times great experiences & athletic achievements. 

Johnny Stone, GO PIRATES & GO VOLS

 

 

Great Post!   You have my vote as well.

[rlh]

On 12/10/2018 at 10:59 AM, tradertwo said:

This is a hot topic rlh, with proponents on both sides having "logical" arguments. In addition to logic and facts, I like to consider everything involved and how the facts affect everyone involved. Consolidation usually eliminates a few positions and condenses maintenance of facilities, while incurring large up front expenses and increasing busing expense into perpetuity. Long story short... into the foreseeable future the expenditures/savings are nullified. So why do it? Advocates argue diversity of course offerings and campus security, while those against counter with student performance and community involvement. If you want to stick to scientific findings, schools ranging from 600 to 900 students most effectively balance curriculum and optimizing student performance.

   What very few proponents of consolidation want to address is the effect of closing schools on the communities in which they are located, and the impact on individual students in outlying areas of the county. Boarding a bus every morning two hours before, and exiting two hours after school isn't considered... businesses dependent on localized activity isn't considered... school support by those same businesses and the community as a whole isn't considered, as well as other "small" issues made more difficult to monitor and police, such as truancy, abuse, bullying, ect…

   My personal viewpoint is that small rural schools offer security and individuality to the students that the large ones can't match. Diversity of curriculum is good on paper, but by percentages of student application's, it is more for propaganda than application. I would be much more comfortable sending my kid to a school on a bus driven by my neighbor, where the principal and most teachers were my classmates, and most of the students and their families are familiar to me. Also, even though the school system has no "official" affiliation with, nor duty to the community in which the school is located, I (personal opinion here) feel that our schools "owe" a gratitude to them for policing, servicing, and supporting the school. Last, but not least... those "positions" that proponents desire to eliminate are held (in majority) by good taxpaying county residents who depend on their jobs. If consolidation eliminates 9 positions (roughly $460,000.00), yet incurs an up front cost of 10 million for construction, and increases the transportation budget by $90,000.00 per year...well, you do the math.

Outstanding post!

[Roy Dillard]

2 hours ago, FridayMainEvent said:

Great Post!   You have my vote as well.

Agent man can you believe these jailhouse fellars are trying to have Griders school shutdown? This is a bunch of mess. I garuntee I aint joking either. 

[rlh]

1 hour ago, Roy Dillard said:

Agent man can you believe these jailhouse fellars are trying to have Griders school shutdown? This is a bunch of mess. I garuntee I aint joking either. 

If you can't beat the Pirates or those magic Tigers, then go nuclear by shutting them down.  That fear the snatched beard man is afraid to play that Boldin man.