Recruiting

[VolunteerGeneral]

I want to get people`s opinion on what they term as recruiting. So much has been claimed that private schools recruit their athletes, that I think we should discuss exactly what recruiting is and what might be termed unfair. Give it some thought before you post and let`s break down this thing called recruiting.

 

I`ll start by asking a question...Let`s say that I am a parent of a child at a ABC private school and my son plays DixieBoys(13-14 year old league) baseball with a kid that is a pretty good ballplayer and I mention to his parents at a game during the summer that they should check out ABC private school. Am I guilty of recruiting? Have I just given my school an unfair advantage over XYZ public rural school? What is your opinion? Did I cross that line?

 

VG

[ELA]

Posted by VolunteerGeneral:

I want to get people`s opinion on what they term as recruiting. So much has been claimed that private schools recruit their athletes, that I think we should discuss exactly what recruiting is and what might be termed unfair. Give it some thought before you post and let`s break down this thing called recruiting.

 

I`ll start by asking a question...Let`s say that I am a parent of a child at a ABC private school and my son plays DixieBoys(13-14 year old league) baseball with a kid that is a pretty good ballplayer and I mention to his parents at a game during the summer that they should check out ABC private school. Am I guilty of recruiting? Have I just given my school an unfair advantage over XYZ public rural school? What is your opinion? Did I cross that line?

 

VG

 

According to the TSSAA rules, NO... because you are not a teacher, coach, or faculty at the ABC private school. Are you recruiting, YES. This is the large "grey area" that exists in the debate that no one can solve.

[itzme]

Posted by ELA:

Posted by VolunteerGeneral:

I want to get people`s opinion on what they term as recruiting. So much has been claimed that private schools recruit their athletes, that I think we should discuss exactly what recruiting is and what might be termed unfair. Give it some thought before you post and let`s break down this thing called recruiting.

 

I`ll start by asking a question...Let`s say that I am a parent of a child at a ABC private school and my son plays DixieBoys(13-14 year old league) baseball with a kid that is a pretty good ballplayer and I mention to his parents at a game during the summer that they should check out ABC private school. Am I guilty of recruiting? Have I just given my school an unfair advantage over XYZ public rural school? What is your opinion? Did I cross that line?

 

VG

 

According to the TSSAA rules, NO... because you are not a teacher, coach, or faculty at the ABC private school. Are you recruiting, YES. This is the large "grey area" that exists in the debate that no one can solve.

 

Here's another example I saw. One of the primary accusations in the BA fiasco was that the football program sent letters about the start of summer workouts to some middle schoolers who, although they had visited the school and told people they were going to attend, were not yet officially enrolled. Shortly after that, I saw an advertisement in the Brentwood Blaze Jr. football league program asking that players and parents check out MBA, and that summer workouts were starting soon. This was "signed" by Ricky Bowers. No issue there I guess? That was the point at which I understood that the rules were too complex and unevenly enforced.

 

I'm not sure what the right answer is, but the system is not very good as currently set up.

[KCHSCoach]

Belive it or not, public schools do not have a monopoly on students. There is such a thing a free speech in this country. There is no gray area here. As long as I am not a coach or an agent of the school, and applying undue pressure on a kid, it is not recruiting. People have a right to express their ideas. Companies have a right to advertise and tell customers what they have to offer, and believe it or not so do schools.

 

And besides, public schools recruit as well, infact I would say there are lot more kids out of "zone" than anyone relalize.

[ELA]

Posted by itzme:

Posted by ELA:

Posted by VolunteerGeneral:

I want to get people`s opinion on what they term as recruiting. So much has been claimed that private schools recruit their athletes, that I think we should discuss exactly what recruiting is and what might be termed unfair. Give it some thought before you post and let`s break down this thing called recruiting.

 

I`ll start by asking a question...Let`s say that I am a parent of a child at a ABC private school and my son plays DixieBoys(13-14 year old league) baseball with a kid that is a pretty good ballplayer and I mention to his parents at a game during the summer that they should check out ABC private school. Am I guilty of recruiting? Have I just given my school an unfair advantage over XYZ public rural school? What is your opinion? Did I cross that line?

 

VG

 

According to the TSSAA rules, NO... because you are not a teacher, coach, or faculty at the ABC private school. Are you recruiting, YES. This is the large "grey area" that exists in the debate that no one can solve.

 

Here's another example I saw. One of the primary accusations in the BA fiasco was that the football program sent letters about the start of summer workouts to some middle schoolers who, although they had visited the school and told people they were going to attend, were not yet officially enrolled. Shortly after that, I saw an advertisement in the Brentwood Blaze Jr. football league program asking that players and parents check out MBA, and that summer workouts were starting soon. This was "signed" by Ricky Bowers. No issue there I guess? That was the point at which I understood that the rules were too complex and unevenly enforced.

 

I'm not sure what the right answer is, but the system is not very good as currently set up.

 

I have heard some suggest that maybe the TSSAA should lift all rules regarding recruiting. Can you imagine what would happen if this was to happen? We have already seen what has happened in DII with regards to the amount of money some wealthy private schools are willing to use to bring in the athletes (all sports). Imagine what would happen to those private schools who don't have "large pockets," all of the talent in Nashville would end up on about four private school teams and they would dominate whatever class they are placed in (DI or DII). Some public schools would get better in areas where the local school board allowed transfers from out of zone areas to anyone (most school boards will never open up their zones for other reasons).

 

I thought this might be an interesting thought for all of you guys to consider. OPEN RECRUITING - NO SCHOLARSHIP RULES? WHAT DO YOU THINK?

[itzme]

Posted by ELA:

Posted by itzme:

Posted by ELA:

Posted by VolunteerGeneral:

I want to get people`s opinion on what they term as recruiting. So much has been claimed that private schools recruit their athletes, that I think we should discuss exactly what recruiting is and what might be termed unfair. Give it some thought before you post and let`s break down this thing called recruiting.

 

I`ll start by asking a question...Let`s say that I am a parent of a child at a ABC private school and my son plays DixieBoys(13-14 year old league) baseball with a kid that is a pretty good ballplayer and I mention to his parents at a game during the summer that they should check out ABC private school. Am I guilty of recruiting? Have I just given my school an unfair advantage over XYZ public rural school? What is your opinion? Did I cross that line?

 

VG

 

According to the TSSAA rules, NO... because you are not a teacher, coach, or faculty at the ABC private school. Are you recruiting, YES. This is the large "grey area" that exists in the debate that no one can solve.

 

Here's another example I saw. One of the primary accusations in the BA fiasco was that the football program sent letters about the start of summer workouts to some middle schoolers who, although they had visited the school and told people they were going to attend, were not yet officially enrolled. Shortly after that, I saw an advertisement in the Brentwood Blaze Jr. football league program asking that players and parents check out MBA, and that summer workouts were starting soon. This was "signed" by Ricky Bowers. No issue there I guess? That was the point at which I understood that the rules were too complex and unevenly enforced.

 

I'm not sure what the right answer is, but the system is not very good as currently set up.

 

I have heard some suggest that maybe the TSSAA should lift all rules regarding recruiting. Can you imagine what would happen if this was to happen? We have already seen what has happened in DII with regards to the amount of money some wealthy private schools are willing to use to bring in the athletes (all sports). Imagine what would happen to those private schools who don't have "large pockets," all of the talent in Nashville would end up on about four private school teams and they would dominate whatever class they are placed in (DI or DII). Some public schools would get better in areas where the local school board allowed transfers from out of zone areas to anyone (most school boards will never open up their zones for other reasons).

 

I thought this might be an interesting thought for all of you guys to consider. OPEN RECRUITING - NO SCHOLARSHIP RULES? WHAT DO YOU THINK?

 

ELA, what have you seen "with regards to the amount of money some wealthy private schools are willing to use to bring in the athletes (all sports)." I'm asking in all sincerity because I don't know. Other than scholarships, what else is done?

[pujo]

Private schools are a business, for them to succeed they have to sell a good product, in most cases education or possibly a good athletic program. All they need do, is hire a knowledgable football coach, word of mouth will take care of the rest. That is the best form of advertisement anyway. We all like to win, and if a private school takes a notion they want to have a winning footall program it is a lot easier and faster for them to build one then a small rural 1a public schools. Any school that could do this, private or public, if they were interested in winning would. The only difference a public school will get into trouble for it. Privates can reload every year, and most public schools have to wait for whatever comes along. People makes a big deal about how little the private schools coaches make, but I guarantee you they make more then the coaches at these small 1a public schools. The only small 1a public schools that have great coaching are the schools lucky enough to have a coach that is loyal to the school. Cloudland, Trousdale, Greenback, are such small schools, but most rural 1a coaches come and go. Another reason that the privates can get knowledgable coaches is the ease of caoching in private schools, compared to public schools. These schools have smart, coachable, teachable kids with parents who support them. In the public school system it's hard to keep the boys in shape over the summer because they have no control over them, and the parents don't have the time to worry with it, or just don't care. I won't call it recruiting, but it is an obvious advantage that we should not have to contend with as a small rural 1a public school. At least, a multiplier should be enforced, and then we'll get to hear from the 2a and 3a schools. Take for instance Boyd Buchanan, who the first two games of the season played two good 4a teams, and they won both games. This is fine for now, and they love the good competition until it gets play-off time then they really enjoy the 1a competition. Something is just not right, and I can see in the near future, maybe next year, when the scheduling takes place schools are going to quit playing them. The only schedules they'll be able to get is within their division, another private, or a really big school (but the big school may not want to risk getting beat, and refuse to play them as well). Are you'll so blind you can't see that everyone knows that the privates have advantages, and when you private supporters deny that fact it makes you look stupid. It's not your fault that they have advantages, it's just the way the system works, but be man enough to admit it. I have seen a few on here that can, but not many.

[RealGoEagles]

Pujo,

you said it's hard to control the kids over the summer.

 

Isn't that another way of saying they don't work as hard as the kids at private schools.

 

Also if this advantage is so prevelant could someone tell me why in my 4 years at Ezell we were 1-9 against public schools, and that public school was Gleason.

[ELA]

ELA, what have you seen "with regards to the amount of money some wealthy private schools are willing to use to bring in the athletes (all sports)." I'm asking in all sincerity because I don't know. Other than scholarships, what else is done?

 

I'm talking about how much money SOME of the larger, wealthier DII schools spend on scholarships for athletes! There was an article in one of the papers last June or July and another in the Early part of Spring about the hundreds of thousands of dollars in scholarships that some offer now that DII schools have not limits! I understand that scholarships and recruiting are two different things, but if we can't agree on how to fix the problems OR that there even is a problem; I say, lets bring the DII boys back, do away with all recruiting and scholarship rules and PLAY BALL! We will then see who cries the most, and I'm sure it won't be the small rural public schools! The only reason we are still upset is because we are the only ones currently being affected by this matter. The solution the TSSAA came up with in the fall/winter of 1996 was to fix the problems for the larger public schools who have the resources and "pull" to complain the most. I think if nothing is to be done about the status quo, let's do away with the rules that are somewhat unenforceable and bring everyone back together.

[Edited by ELA on 9-3-02 10:56A]

 

[itzme]

Posted by ELA:

ELA, what have you seen "with regards to the amount of money some wealthy private schools are willing to use to bring in the athletes (all sports)." I'm asking in all sincerity because I don't know. Other than scholarships, what else is done?

 

I'm talking about how much money SOME of the larger, wealthier DII schools spend on scholarships for athletes! There was an article in one of the papers last June or July and another in the Early part of Spring about the hundreds of thousands of dollars in scholarships that some offer now that DII schools have not limits! I understand that scholarships and recruiting are two different things, but if we can't agree on how to fix the problems OR that there even is a problem; I say, lets bring the DII boys back, do away with all recruiting and scholarship rules and PLAY BALL! We will then see who cries the most, and I'm sure it won't be the small rural public schools! The only reason we are still upset is because we are the only ones currently being affected by this matter. The solution the TSSAA came up with in the fall/winter of 1996 was to fix the problems for the larger public schools who have the resources and "pull" to complain the most. I think if nothing is to be done about the status quo, let's do away with the rules that are somewhat unenforceable and bring everyone back together.

[Edited by ELA on 9-3-02 10:56A]

 

OK...that makes sense. Clearly a scholarship at MBA or BA is worth a lot of money. I certainly agree that the big public schools (or should I say school ) got what they wanted a few years back, and it seems to have left some of the smaller publics at a disadvantage.

 

I for one, would love to see a "Super Conference" with both public and private school teams. I believe it would be good for HS football in our state to see Riverdale, Brentwood Academy, Oakland, MBA, etc. play every year. That will never happen, of course, but it would be fun!!

[TheEgoHasLanded]

ELA I remember the article you spoke of...and I think Baylor led the way at like 134,000 and McCallie was second. BA might have been fifth or something...but they only have 325 people. That doesn't effect any of us, and I don't see why we are talking about it.

[VolunteerGeneral]

Most of this thread has moved toward the Div.II schools. I had no intention when I started it to include Div. II schools. Hey guys they can recruit. Let`s limit this to Div. I schools. That is where the controversy lies.

 

Ela... my example is not a grey area. If a kid lives in the vicinity of Jackson, then he and is family are already well aware of the 3 private schools in town. It doesn`t take a suggestion to make someone aware that "hey there is a private school in town" Either the parents are interested or they are not. If the thought of attending a local private school has entered their mind, then it wouldn`t make any difference what I said. Even if they did visit the school, It wouldn`t be my decision if they were to choose to dish out the several thousands of dollars that it would cost them. Not only that, but their child would be subjected to an entrance exam before they would be accepted.

 

To All....What is recruiting? I hear it over and over. Private schools recruit. Would someone tell me how they do it?