Why doesn't maryville play other states top teams?

[Red Rebels]

We have one who drives down the mountain from Deals Gap, NC.

[warrior82dad]

Help me with something here.

 

Are "open zone" schools still restricted to the county in which they are located?

Yes they are, but all you have to do is look in the student parking lot at Maryville and see the out of county license plates. The problem is there in no enforcement anymore. Thats one reason why the TSSAA wants the division.

[Red Rebels]

What is open zone? We have very defined and strict rules. This is a Pandora's box where every school will have to prove a negative. Even Riverdale.

[Hubbard]

Yes they are, but all you have to do is look in the student parking lot at Maryville and see the out of county license plates. The problem is there in no enforcement anymore. Thats one reason why the TSSAA wants the division.

So the issue is not the "open zone", it is a lack of TSSAA's ability or willingness to enforce rules?

Edited August 26, 2015 by Hubbard

[warrior82dad]

Here is an article on the division and the debate.http://t.co/wOQefGT8uB

Edited August 26, 2015 by warrior82dad

[warrior82dad]

So the issue is not the "open zone", it is a lack of TSSAA's ability or willingness to enforce rules?

They know they dont have the physical ability to police each school and we all know the schools dont police themselevs. Thats why they are looking to control it through division. It happened in Ohio and the "big Schools" like Maryville that were open enrollment suffered but the private Catholic Scholls grew and became dominate in the private setting and in the state.

[Red Rebels]

That Kentucky kid has been staying in my basement over the weekend. The deal was he had to go home Friday night after home games or Saturday morning after away games.

[warrior82dad]

That Kentucky kid has been staying in my basement over the weekend. The deal was he had to go home Friday night after home games or Saturday morning after away games.

The one thing about this blog...theres aways a moron..

[Red Rebels]

I'm talking to him!

[Red Rebels]

Out of county plates in the MHS parking lot. That was just a big lie. You just make stuff up! And I'm the "moron"!

[warrior82dad]

I'm talking to him!

Dont show your ignorance, its not becoming of the Maryville status..

[warrior82dad]

I know this doesnt have pictures and may not hold your interest but knowledge is king..

 

Private schools are getting away with murder. Public schools are no better and have engaged in illegal recruiting for years. What about open enrollment and city schools? They are the biggest violators of them all. These are all statements I’ve heard from coaches and others associated with high school football over the years. The problem is that when I interview them on any of my radio shows, many of them go into a shell and regurgitate the same old company line about respecting the TSSAA’s decision on all matters and blah, blah, blah. I wanted to come to an informed and educated opinion on the subject, and to do that, I needed brutally honest answers to some questions. I also knew that to acquire the type of honest answers I needed from a coaching fraternity that treats their programs and what they say with a level of paranoia akin to someone protecting nuclear launch codes would be impossible. So I granted the coaches with something that made honesty possible: Anonymity.

To the credit of the TSSAA, they cooperated with this story and will be the only group that’s officially on the record. I also wanted possible solutions from the coaches polled and not just a barrage of complaints on the current system. Some of the answers surprised me and led me down a path I never thought I would consider. Let’s begin with the questions posed to our panel of coaches:

1. What is your overall record as a head and/or assistant coach?
2. What is the biggest disadvantage for your program in the current system?
3. Biggest advantage?
4. Who is the biggest beneficiary of the current system?
5. Is cheating a problem with some TSSAA programs?
6. Specifically, how would you change the current system? Would you change it at all?

This line of questioning was intended to accomplish a number of things. First and foremost, I wanted coaches to acknowledge their own advantages. Too often, we only hear griping and complaining from people about all of the obstacles in their way or how it’s constantly “us against the worldâ€. This mentality is especially prevalent in the coaching profession. I wanted to balance out that inclination with an honest assessment of how the current system benefits their programs. We also wanted the complaints. And we got some. In the end, I’m more concerned with a solution, and that’s why I asked the coaches to provide one. The point of this exercise is to come up with a solution. The problem with this is that whatever solution I come up with will upset someone. There is no perfect answer that appeases everyone… But there is one that makes the most sense for most everyone involved.

We interviewed a cross-section of coaches with varying backgrounds and success levels across the area. Both Division II-A and AA programs are represented in our survey as well as a private Division I program playing in a region full of public schools (stop trying to guess the coaches). We also spoke with public school coaches that range from 1A-6A. 

Before we get to the unedited, uncensored responses from the coaches it’s important to know the stance of the state’s governing body, the TSSAA. I reached out to Executive Director Bernard Childress and here is what he had to say. 

Our organization is divided into nine Athletic Districts (3 each in Middle, East, and West TN). Each Athletic District has one Board of Control and Legislative Council member. These individuals are elected by the schools in their District to serve a three year term. Currently, there are no DII administrators serving as voting members on either body. We do have an ex-officio member representing the Tennessee Association of Independent Schools.

Independent schools currently make up appropriately 18% of the membership. It is important that all schools continue to participate under the same rules and regulations which are voted on by the schools. All eligibility requirements are decided by the member schools themselves. The playing rules are national rules decided by the NFHS. It would be very difficult for our independent schools to get regular season contests with out-of-state teams if there were two separate organizations. The NFHS will only recognize one state association and the majority do not let their schools play against non-member schools. If we are in this for the right reasons which is the provide opportunities for young people in order to enhance their education, we need to ask them. They do not care who they play. They only want to compete and have fun doing it.

The Public/Private school debate has been going on in every state for at least 25 years. It continues today in every state that has both in their Association. However, it definitely can be argued that the influx of charter, magnet, and open enrollment schools has given those schools just as much of an advantage to attract students from a wider area.

That’s their public stance and it’s a solid one. We should ultimately be concerned about the kids involved in the competition and less about the parents and coaches. Unfortunately, that’s not reality. The adults tend to screw things up. And that’s the main reason you’ve seen change after change in the classification system in the last 15 years. We interviewed highly respected Brentwood Coach Ron Crawford on this week’s “Prep Weekly†radio show and he believes there was nothing wrong with the old five classification system that the state played under in the early 2000’s. “I don’t remember anyone complaining about it and yet it changed.†he said. Maybe change is inevitable even if no one is complaining. So what happens when many are complaining? We asked our panel of coaches what should happen next with the TSSAA.

The coaches that agreed to take part in our survey all did so under the understanding that they would be kept anonymous. We did this to get the most honest answers possible without fear of repercussions. These coaches have combined to win 59% of their games. It was important to me to get a cross-section of both public and private schools as well as Division I and Division II. I also didn’t want to only poll coaches who win all the time or ones that have a long history of losing. What did they have to say about the current state of the public/private debate in the state of Tennessee?

It’s extremely difficult to get coaches to discuss the advantages that their program naturally gives them. That’s why I asked them to acknowledge them. One Division II coach acknowledged that the major advantage lies in the ability to attract athletes from outside of their community to his school. Another coach took it a step further and mentioned his ability to hire more coaches, negotiate salaries, and bring on full-time strength coaches. These advantages coupled with an increased emphasis on facilities upgrades are some of the reasons that Division II schools don’t compete for state championships with public schools. None of these advantages surprise anyone. Some of the answers we got from public school coaches may surprise some. A coach in 3A tells us that the biggest advantage to public schools is that they have a “voice in legislation whereas smaller private schools do notâ€. He went on to admit that some private schools are not benefitting from the multiplier system. A 5A coach also pointed to the ability for his program to schedule non-region games as an advantage that private schools don’t have.

When we asked coaches about the disadvantages the current system presents for their programs, they gave a broad array of answers. One public school coach pointed to the new re-classification putting his program at a disadvantage from a travel perspective. There is an inability to get buses due to dismissals in the school system and is a budget burden for teams that have to travel exceptionally long distances for region games. A different public school coach pointed to the perception of private schools as a disadvantage for public school programs: “The inability to attract potential student athletes to come to our school in the same manner as a private school is a disadvantage. Many parents view the facilities and resources of private schools as a better opportunity for their kids, which is understandable, but parents need to understand there are quality programs and opportunities in the public sector as well.†The biggest complaint from private schools is the trouble they have scheduling games outside of their own region. One small, private school coach referenced his program having to play much bigger public and private school teams that leads to a higher risk of injury and a bigger number in the loss column. One possible disadvantage I had never thought of was the same coach explaining a “highly saturated private school marketâ€. There are more programs now with more to offer making it tougher for a few teams to load up on top athletes. It also almost completely removes some smaller, private programs from consideration from top players in the market to attend a private school.

We also asked our coaches who they thought were the biggest beneficiaries of the current system. I expected this question to trigger finger pointing in the direction of the other side of this battle. What we got was a surprisingly mixed bag. One Division II-A coach said that “based on records, it appears to be open zoned or city public schools along with private schools playing in public regions.†Open enrollment schools are not defined by a specific geographic parameter like most public schools. Any student that wants to attend an open enrollment or city school can do so by paying a small fee. Maryville and Alcoa are two examples of open enrollment schools. Last I checked, they have a good track record of football success. There are other examples out there but those are two of the most prominent. Which leads to the obvious question of how to legislate open enrollment programs along with public and private. This is an issue that TSSAA Executive Director Bernard Childress is trying to tackle and alludes to that with this excerpt from his statement we showed you earlier: 

it definitely can be argued that the influx of charter, magnet, and open enrollment schools has given those schools just as much of an advantage to attract students from a wider area.

So are open enrollment schools the true beneficiary of the current system? Are they the snakes in the grass that no one is paying attention to because of the friendly elephants right in front of their faces? Maybe so, but one 3A public school coach points directly to his own governing body as to who is the big winner in all of this. “Honestly, I believe the TSSAA is the biggest beneficiary in all of this. There is more money being made now than ever before.â€

 

The Solution

The easy solution would be for everyone to play within the rules and worry more about enriching the lives of their student athletes and less about wins and losses. But we all know that will never happen. We live in America and as Americans we demand to have a winner and a loser. There is no grey area… Except when there is a grey area. One large private school coach tells us that “bending the rules will always be a problem because many of the bylaws have grey areas that cause coaches and administration to see differently.†So the question at hand is , how do we eliminate the grey? Some Division II coaches would have you believe that a complete separation from the TSSAA is the answer. Why work under a governing body that doesn’t care about us enough to have one representative on the board of control. Division II coaches have a valid point, but as Childress brought up, it would suddenly be impossible to schedule TSSAA teams in-state and scheduling out-of-state opponents would be nearly impossible because of the NFHS only recognizing one governing body in each state. Suddenly the difficult task of scheduling non-region games would be virtually impossible. I may be in the minority, but I don’t think the Division II system is broken. Keep it the same with one exception: Add a lower third tier of private schools that are currently in public school regions. You would then have a Division II-A consisting of private schools currently playing in public regions. If those schools don’t want to offer financial assistance like the larger Division II schools, that’s fine. They can simply be the TSSAA Small Private School Division. You would then have current Division II-A programs moving up to Division II-AA and the super elite Division II-AA would become even more super and elite as the brand new Division II-AAA. The main question that keeps bothering me is how to address the problem of open enrollment programs. My answer is this: If you penalize private schools with a multiplier rule because of their ability to attract students from outside their geographically zoned area, do the same for public, open enrollment schools that do the exact same thing. The current private school multiplier is 1.8. I don’t know if it should be that high, but it should be something. So what about Maryville? Here is a school that’s already dominant in the state’s biggest classification (6A). Do you multiply them up to a non-existent 7A? The only real answer to that question is to create a separate classification of open enrollment and city schools. Then and only then would you have a true, “fair playing fieldâ€. But that’s not going to happen. Nor will an end to the public/private/open-enrollment debate. The war wages on.