Poll: Public-Private Vote

[Southtowner]

it was in the article the other day.  i looked for it but cant find it.  it was from one of the links on CoachT's home page.  Funny how the bank just added the exact amount to the account.  I need to use that bank.

 

http://www.timesfreepress.com/news/sports/preps/story/2015/jul/19/tssavote-may-prove-wise-long-run/315336/

[Indian]

Right now, complete split has 1 less vote than the rest of the choices combined. That ought to say something.

[RonMexico3]

it was in the article the other day. i looked for it but cant find it. it was from one of the links on CoachT's home page. Funny how the bank just added the exact amount to the account. I need to use that bank.

I read the article. An anonymous mother is a pretty sketchy source. Is the TSSAA investigating?

[big red big blue]

This is a really well-written article...the Free Press has done the best job of anyone covering this subject.  Of course, the things the author points out regarding d2 were both predictable, and predicted, and presumably why Childress somehow managed to convince the BOC to vote against the split, despite overwhelming support for it.

 

Specifically, prior to the split in '96, honestly, sports just weren't that big a deal at these d2 schools, evidenced best by the lack of titles in any sports claimed by 6 of the 7 original "super 7."  At the highest classification (3A) where most financial aid schools were playing, the last football title claimed at the time of the split was 20 years prior.  Mainly that's because there was a limit in each sport to how many financial aid recipients could dress for varsity sports (4 in football, 2 in basketball).  Once those limits were released with the split, the money (which was abundant) flowed in across the board...unlimited financial aid recipients, top-notch facilities, massive coaching staffs (go to an MBA, BA, or Ensworth game and count the # of former Titans walking the sidelines as assistants)...it's how a school like Ensworth can become a dominant force in all sports just 10 years after its doors opened.

 

I hate to break it to the Maplewood principal, who is voicing a real concern, but here in Middle TN, the parents WANT the private schools to come to their middle school games.  It's an unfortunate side effect of a very bad decision made 20 years ago...namely the horrible state of football in Metro Nashville versus where it was 20 years ago.  All these families are dreaming of going to MBA, BA, or Ensworth....I had a dad of a kid who my son plays baseball with--alum of Whites Creek (at one time a dominant team in Nashville)--ask me what the best way was to get the attention of the private schools (as if I knew)...he is sending his 12 year old to year-round football coaching....

Edited July 22, 2015 by big red big blue

[Indian]

I read the article. An anonymous mother is a pretty sketchy source. Is the TSSAA investigating?

The writer has been at the TFP 25 years, even anonymous I don't think he includes it without feeling there is something to it. If there is I dont think it would be too hard to get.to the bottom if but there has to be an effort.to do so.

[FBfan26]

This is a really well-written article...the Free Press has done the best job of anyone covering this subject. Of course, the things the author points out regarding d2 were both predictable, and predicted, and presumably why Childress somehow managed to convince the BOC to vote against the split, despite overwhelming support for it.

 

Specifically, prior to the split in '96, honestly, sports just weren't that big a deal at these d2 schools, evidenced best by the lack of titles in any sports claimed by 6 of the 7 original "super 7." At the highest classification (3A) where most financial aid schools were playing, the last football title claimed at the time of the split was 20 years prior. Mainly that's because there was a limit in each sport to how many financial aid recipients could dress for varsity sports (4 in football, 2 in basketball). Once those limits were released with the split, the money (which was abundant) flowed in across the board...unlimited financial aid recipients, top-notch facilities, massive coaching staffs (go to an MBA, BA, or Ensworth game and count the # of former Titans walking the sidelines as assistants)...it's how a school like Ensworth can become a dominant force in all sports just 10 years after its doors opened.

 

I hate to break it to the Maplewood principal, who is voicing a real concern, but here in Middle TN, the parents WANT the private schools to come to their middle school games. It's an unfortunate side effect of a very bad decision made 20 years ago...namely the horrible state of football in Metro Nashville versus where it was 20 years ago. All these families are dreaming of going to MBA, BA, or Ensworth....I had a dad of a kid who my son plays baseball with--alum of Whites Creek (at one time a dominant team in Nashville)--ask me what the best way was to get the attention of the private schools (as if I knew)...he is sending his 12 year old to year-round football coaching....

Very tru...The cure to get kids in metro is winning and coaches who relate. Even then you still have a few players who dart for private schools then end back up in metro schools after a year or two. Now about the splits each split has flaws. If you do the open/ rural split which the rural county's want they would have to travel alot more then the open zone schools. What I was reading a couple days ago Metro Nashville itself would be all considered openzones - a few. Now the private public thing its kinda crazy. I'm just going to say Cpa. I love playing them when we do and in football they can be beat. But when it comes to basketball baseball soccer tennis ping pong whatever they are going to win and there's nothing that and we can do about it. They have the height, resources coaches everything you need to be successful.

[big red big blue]

Very tru...The cure to get kids in metro is winning and coaches who relate. Even then you still have a few players who dart for private schools then end back up in metro schools after a year or two. Now about the splits each split has flaws. If you do the open/ rural split which the rural county's want they would have to travel alot more then the open zone schools. What I was reading a couple days ago Metro Nashville itself would be all considered openzones - a few. Now the private public thing its kinda crazy. I'm just going to say Cpa. I love playing them when we do and in football they can be beat. But when it comes to basketball baseball soccer tennis ping pong whatever they are going to win and there's nothing that and we can do about it. They have the height, resources coaches everything you need to be successful.

I'm hoping Metro Nashville football can be great again someday, because at one time it was great.  I actually think the tide will turn in basketball sooner than football...look at what David Keary is doing with the NYBA here.  They are building basketball from the ground up...in 5-6 years, those kids will be on Metro rosters (assuming all the private schools don't grab them up)....they will be able to compete with anyone...

Edited July 22, 2015 by big red big blue

[Southtowner]

From the Daily Post - Athenian

 

EDITOR'S NOTE: Sports Writer Scott Power will present an alternate viewpoint on the Tennessee Secondary School Athletic Association and the public-private split topic later this week.

 

The TSSAA Legislative Council's defeat of the public-private split Thursday was vexing for most of the state's public schools - the latest frustrating decision in a seemingly endless decades-long line of them.

 

It was also the most practical decision the council could have made that day.

 

Admittedly, the practicality of defeating the split comes entirely out of the TSSAA's self-interest. Regardless of any of the other reasons for letting 24 private schools stick around in the same division as all of the state's public schools, the TSSAA's main objective is to not be dragged back to court, a possibility alluded to by several council members in post-vote interviews.

 

Understandable, since the TSSAA's legal fees nearly hit the $3 million mark during its decade-long battle against Brentwood Academy's highly publicized lawsuit in the 2000s.

 

And the TSSAA's self-interest comes from a powerful position, too, being for better or worse the nationally recognized governing body of prep athletics in Tennessee and being responsible for making and enforcing the rules, coordinating officiating, organizing the means for schools to win championships, and protecting schools from liability in case of injury to athletes. A TSSAA financial implosion might seem like a welcome dose of karma to some, but the fallout would be tantamount to short-term anarchy, to say nothing of the national image tarnish Tennessee high school sports could take as a result.

 

Money talks

 

Had the split been passed Thursday, it would've happened with the private schools it directly affects having no say in the matter, as no member of the Legislative Council (and for that matter the Board of Control) is a private school representative.

 

The public schools have no sympathy for that fact, as demonstrated by the comments of coaches and officials from McMinn Central and Meigs County, the two area schools who have to compete directly with privates.

 

"I guess 24 schools overrules 280 schools," said Meigs County boys' basketball coach Sammy Perkinson, whose Tigers have to deal with Knoxville's Grace Christian Academy in their district.

 

"You have member schools vote and offer their input, and it's like they (the council) disregard the vote," added Central athletic director Doug Armstrong.

 

Central's football team has two-time Class 3A champion Christian Academy of Knoxville, a private school, to tangle with.

 

But money talks, and the private schools hold the TSSAA with a tight string there. Not only by the money the TSSAA makes off the private schools' vast wealth, but by the money the TSSAA could stand to bleed if taken to court again.

 

And a forced split - again without any representation on the council making that decision - would be as good a reason as any for the private schools to give their lawyers a call to battle.

 

And for the TSSAA, it wouldn't even matter if its defense was successful. After all, its defense against Brentwood Academy's lawsuit was eventually successful, but it still lost nearly $3 million and was on the edge of bankruptcy as recently as five years ago as a direct result.

 

It's obvious the TSSAA does not want to deal with that possibility again, nor would it be good for high school athletics if it happened.

 

More of the same?

 

The Legislative Council will meet again in mid-September, this time to draft a series of bylaw changes that addresses concrete issues of fair competition that affect public and private schools.

 

Why it couldn't have identified and acted upon these issues in the 20-something years the topic of public versus private competition has been discussed, plus the 16 months since the latest proposal for the split was first introduced, is certainly another source of the ongoing frustration felt by public school administrations and prep sports fans alike.

 

But that the council even elected to call another meeting in a relatively short two months, and that it identified more specific concerns than it has at any point in the last three decades, indicates that this council may indeed be a lot more committed to getting it right.

 

In particular, work study - in which athletes work for the school to pay tuition - is a big deal for private schools. As are family members working for the school, tuition reductions for family members attending or working for the school, and the hiring of non-faculty coaches.

 

In a July 13 report from the Johnson City Press, Legislative Council Representative Keith Turner said that the majority of private schools currently in Division I would voluntarily move to Division II if a bylaw was drafted for schools to stay in Division I to not allow family members from working for a school in exchange for tuition.

 

If the upcoming series of bylaws makes these private schools want to move on their own accord to Division II, or otherwise successfully results in fairer competition, then that would obviously be ideal.

 

It'd make the private schools' grounds for any lawsuits much shakier, if not non-existent, at any rate.

 

This method of possibly achieving a split may seem "cowardly," and I've heard some refer to it in terms not fit for print, but concerning the TSSAA's bottom line, it's also prudent.

 

And if the new bylaws aren't strong enough, or if public schools get a bit impatient, then there's always the possibility a new proposal could be submitted for a full split, to be voted on as soon as December.

 

At least if such a vote happens then, the private schools can't complain about a lack of representation, as the Legislative Council at that time will have three additional seats filled exclusively by private school administrators.

*

Email: gabriel.garcia@dailypostathenian.com

 

the link : http://www.dailypostathenian.com/sports/article_65f3903b-79c9-5cc7-8e63-1ac08ed48fff.html

[thetruth2008]

I don't care about recruiting. Schools like Lipscomb, CPA and Knoxville Catholic don't need to recruit to attract students to their academic and athletic missions.

 

I care about the declining sense of competition, which exists in an inverse relationship with our athletic leaders' sense of entitlement. "We can't beat them. They're winning at a disproportionate rate. Rather than raising our own standards, let's refuse to play them and kick them out of our league." That's a poor lesson to teach the kids who are developing athletically, mentally and morally under their care.

There's a reason privates win at a disappropriate rate (that's the whole point of the split). So teaching kids that cheating is ok and competition against schools with clear advantages is ok? Spare me the "raising our standards" BS. There are no harder working coaches in this state than public school coaches. Nevermind the fact that they actually teach classes and have other duties besides coaching. Your statement was so far off in la la land that it turned my stomach.

[theRASSLER]

Where could I find who voted for the split and who did not vote for the split on the TSSAA council?

 

It seems to me that the school administrators who represent the schools for the TSSAA voted in a way that did not reflect the opinions of their constituents.........Sound familiar?

 

Maybe we should direct our comments to our politicians on the council.

[Southtowner]

Where could I find who voted for the split and who did not vote for the split on the TSSAA council?

 

It seems to me that the school administrators who represent the schools for the TSSAA voted in a way that did not reflect the opinions of their constituents.........Sound familiar?

 

Maybe we should direct our comments to our politicians on the council.

 

Council members Dan Black (Bradford), William McAdams (Hardin County), Greg McCullough (Memphis Central), Ron Woodard (Maplewood) and Michael Reynolds (Knoxville Central) voted against a split.

 

Dan Gilbert (Soddy-Daisy), Jeff Luttrell (Watertown), Mike Tatum (Lewis County) and Keith Turner (Science Hill) were in favor of the split.

[Indian]

They ought to be throwing out region designs for every possibility plus the playoff format and qualification format on each.