Who is the BEST in the state???

[FR615]

25 minutes ago, Kell16 said:

Yes assuming Baylor has kids that can make weight to move. I know Cleveland can, so all I’m saying is Cleveland has more flexibility for this dual than Baylor does. Cleveland pretty much has 6 starters at 3 weights (113, 165, 190)

Baylor would run through Cleveland 132-157 they could potentially pin Cleveland at every one of those classes. Sturgill vs Fowler and max vs Fowler would be wash if not favoring Baylor. Cleveland would have to get lucky to beat them even with walker at 120 which there is no guarantee he beats Bond. It would be a great a match. Cleveland is a very good team.

Edited January 22 by FR615

[cobrakid8]

39 minutes ago, Kell16 said:

Yes assuming Baylor has kids that can make weight to move. I know Cleveland can, so all I’m saying is Cleveland has more flexibility for this dual than Baylor does. Cleveland pretty much has 6 starters at 3 weights (113, 165, 190)

I’ve seen some of those 3 backups at those 3 weights and yeah, if you think they are all starters at most places that are pretty good teams I don’t know what to tell you! Anyone can go and look at their records in track and those kids can do great work against teams that aren’t all that good and their varsity isn’t that good, they would have trouble against actual good teams with good varsity wrestlers at those weights! There is some depth for sure there, but most good teams have that and I’m sure I could do some more looking at Baylor and some of their kids that wrestle as backup varsity and see if they have any. But again I’ve seen that bite many teams in the #### through 25-30 years! They think some backup can come in there and either win or not get pinned and they come out, get stuck and they are left scrambling to make up for something they prob would have been better just wrestling straight up. Just like with Trey stating Cleveland would get a pin at 215, the best varsity kid from Cleveland got teched pretty quickly while the kid from Baylor got beat by same Father Ryan kid 3-2. I was giving that a decision I think and it actually could turn out to be a pin or tech for Baylor. They finally got their football guys back since they actually did something in the playoffs and it’s finally made their team full strength.

Edited January 22 by cobrakid8

[KellG16]

6 minutes ago, FR615 said:

Baylor would run through Cleveland 132-157 they could potentially pin Cleveland at every one of those classes. Sturgill vs Fowler and max vs Fowler would be wash if not favoring Baylor. Cleveland would have to get lucky to beat them even with walker at 120 which there is no guarantee he beats Bond. 

You’re basing this off worst case scenarios for Cleveland. I saw earlier the matchups giving Baylor both Fowlers and toss up with Bond/Walker and it was 34-31 Cleveland. That’s where flexibility comes in at 190 for Cleveland. Syzmborski pins at either weight (most likely). Then the match is decided with Moore for Cleveland. Even if Baylor wins a close match, that should be an embarrassment. Baylor should be expected to destroy any public school in the state with ease and you cannot say they 100% would with Cleveland. Let’s look at 2021 at lake Norman duals, Cleveland “should” have lost and they didn’t! Baylor just robbed Dobyns Bennett with the Norman’s. Where is Baylor without them? If Baylor was on Cleveland’s schedule who is to say cooper Hilton wouldn’t have gotten certified to wrestle then since he lives in the city limits of Cleveland. Regardless Cleveland has done way more with less than Baylor and continues to do so thanks to Knox and Bosken.

[KellG16]

5 minutes ago, cobrakid8 said:

I’ve seen some of those 3 backups at those 3 weights and yeah, if you think they are all starters at most places that are pretty good teams I don’t know what to tell you! Anyone can go and look at their records in track and those kids can do great work against teams that aren’t all that good and their varsity isn’t that good, they would have trouble against actual good teams with good varsity wrestlers at those weights! There is some depth for sure there, but most good teams have that and I’m sure I could do some more looking at Baylor and some of their kids that wrestle as backup varsity and see if they have any. But again I’ve seen that bite many teams in the #### through 25-30 years! They think some backup can come in there and either win or not get pinned and they come out, get stuck and they are left scrambling to make up for something they prob would have been better just wrestling straight up. Just like with Trey stating Cleveland would get a pin at 215, the best varsity kid from Cleveland got teched pretty quickly while the kid from Baylor got beat by same Father Ryan kid 3-2. I was giving that a decision I think and it actually could turn out to be a pin or tech for Baylor. They finally got their football guys back since they actually did something in the playoffs and it’s finally made their team full strength.

First of all, my not talking about backups. Let me explain,

113/120 - walker/maughon

165/175 - both fowlers

190 - Syzmborski/moore

 

NOT BACKUPS!

and on the FR vs Clev at 215, Moore got pinned after being up 6-2 in the second when he got caught. What happens if Moore goes 190 (his actual weight) and Syzmborski at 215? Pin at 215 for Cleveland , that’s what happens.

 

[cobrakid8]

2 minutes ago, Kell16 said:

First of all, my not talking about backups. Let me explain,

113/120 - walker/maughon

165/175 - both fowlers

190 - Syzmborski/moore

 

NOT BACKUPS!

and on the FR vs Clev at 215, Moore got pinned after being up 6-2 in the second when he got caught. What happens if Moore goes 190 (his actual weight) and Syzmborski at 215? Pin at 215 for Cleveland , that’s what happens.

 

But again that’s the thing, you can’t move people around in a made up scenario! You run it straight up because you have no idea WHO has the ability to move people where! If Cleveland has to run out someone against anyone when they have to send out first that sets a lot of their lineups! Not sure if you have ever done it but you can have the best laid plans ever and they can quickly go out the window when the flip is done. Been there done it and seen it. I mean if the fowlers get set and have to wrestle where they are, Baylor at that point can move one of their hammers around to get pins elsewhere. Plus do you have any idea the backups at ANY of Baylors positions? 
 

also no crying about recruiting! I’ve seen wrestlers that “moved” into Cleveland and it’s because they got jobs working for companies owned by either Jones himself or fellow Cleveland alumni, all schools do recruiting so it’s a crap out to use! If you want to run your mouth out about you can beat them, you can’t come back with excuses of why it didn’t happen! Also where is Cooper Hilton originally from? Pretty sure it’s not originally Cleveland, he went there for Boom Ranch did he not? And good lord he’s been around forever, is he like 20 years old? 

[FR615]

18 minutes ago, Kell16 said:

First of all, my not talking about backups. Let me explain,

113/120 - walker/maughon

165/175 - both fowlers

190 - Syzmborski/moore

 

NOT BACKUPS!

and on the FR vs Clev at 215, Moore got pinned after being up 6-2 in the second when he got caught. What happens if Moore goes 190 (his actual weight) and Syzmborski at 215? Pin at 215 for Cleveland , that’s what happens.

 

And Moore takes a loss at 190 vs Joyner. Pretty easy to understand. 

Edited January 22 by FR615

[KellG16]

1 minute ago, FR615 said:

And Moore takes a loss at 190 vs Joyner.

That’s fine, Baylor should be expected to win every match. Isn’t that why there are “divisions” in TN? Baylor is on the same level as a public school.

[TheTreyB]

Better hope Mccallie doesn’t beat Baylor. You hating now you will really hate me then.

[KellG16]

10 minutes ago, cobrakid8 said:

But again that’s the thing, you can’t move people around in a made up scenario! You run it straight up because you have no idea WHO has the ability to move people where! If Cleveland has to run out someone against anyone when they have to send out first that sets a lot of their lineups! Not sure if you have ever done it but you can have the best laid plans ever and they can quickly go out the window when the flip is done. Been there done it and seen it. I mean if the fowlers get set and have to wrestle where they are, Baylor at that point can move one of their hammers around to get pins elsewhere. Plus do you have any idea the backups at ANY of Baylors positions? 
 

also no crying about recruiting! I’ve seen wrestlers that “moved” into Cleveland and it’s because they got jobs working for companies owned by either Jones himself or fellow Cleveland alumni, all schools do recruiting so it’s a crap out to use! If you want to run your mouth out about you can beat them, you can’t come back with excuses of why it didn’t happen! Also where is Cooper Hilton originally from? Pretty sure it’s not originally Cleveland, he went there for Boom Ranch did he not? And good lord he’s been around forever, is he like 20 years old? 

Would you like me to name all the kids on Cleveland’s lineup that have been in the program since MS? What Baylor kids are Baylor MS kids? There is no excuse from Cleveland, last I checked Cleveland won the latest dual matchup vs Baylor. Cleveland has built kids up from youth. If you know anything about Bosken and his your wrestlers he has two kids (who are and will be in Cleveland city schools all the way thru) heading back from Tulsa NATIONALS right now with top 3 finishes. That means top 3 in the COUNTRY. Those are the kinds of kids Cleveland is built around and still competes with and beats (2021) Baylor.
 

to your first paragraph, I stated I knew what Cleveland could do. Exactly what your saying about Cleveland plan going out the window could very easily go out the window for Baylor.

[FR615]

2 minutes ago, Kell16 said:

That’s fine, Baylor should be expected to win every match. Isn’t that why there are “divisions” in TN? Baylor is on the same level as a public school.

This will be last comment on this thread to the Cleveland cult. The truth is finally out for the public to see on Cleveland. They refused a 10 year deal. There is no way around it. I wish both teams success and health the rest of the way. 

[KidGloves]

Ugh. I’m all for smack talk, but this has devolved into something akin to a recess argument. 

Y’all keep arguing about Cleveland and Baylor, but everyone keeps forgetting about Dobbyns Bennet. 

[KidGloves]

5 minutes ago, Kell16 said:

Would you like me to name all the kids on Cleveland’s lineup that have been in the program since MS? What Baylor kids are Baylor MS kids? There is no excuse from Cleveland, last I checked Cleveland won the latest dual matchup vs Baylor. Cleveland has built kids up from youth. If you know anything about Bosken and his your wrestlers he has two kids (who are and will be in Cleveland city schools all the way thru) heading back from Tulsa NATIONALS right now with top 3 finishes. That means top 3 in the COUNTRY. Those are the kinds of kids Cleveland is built around and still competes with and beats (2021) Baylor.
 

to your first paragraph, I stated I knew what Cleveland could do. Exactly what your saying about Cleveland plan going out the window could very easily go out the window for Baylor.

There are quite a few kids that Bosken has developed, but there’s also quite a few that moved to the area. All the Fowlers started in the Mid-state, Syzborski or however you spell it was in the mid-state, Kellen Sanders, a 4x 8th grader was a mid-state kid, mattox high was a GA kid, the Shufts moved from CA, etc etc etc, so while he’s developed quite a few kids, calling Baylor out for nabbing kids from other programs is a bit of the kettle calling the pot black, no? 

Edited January 22 by KidGloves