Private/Public Split Debate

[Indian]

Poor privates. With all the fundraising they have to do to even field teams, an applicant pool that thins out all athletes except the 5.0 40 running backs and 150 pound linemen, you wonder how they ever win a game against a public school.

[lazarus]

"Have you seen CPA or DCA or Ezell?"

 

hevent been to cpa, but have been to dca & ezell.

maybe, just maybe, someday we'll have facilities that nice.

 

"Where do you think that private schools get the money to pay for anything?"

 

i suppose you raise it from your parents just like we do.

what percentage of *your* target market makes under 20K a year?

 

lazarus rule of thumb: it's dang hard to raise money from people whose car is worth more than their house.

[old24eagle]

I said you have NOT seen Boyd. Have you or haven't you? Have you seen CPA or DCA or Ezell?

 

Virtually no tax money? Where do you think that private schools get the money to pay for anything?

 

I have argued this point a thousand times. I know you don't get tax money at privates if you want it go to a public school and quit whining. Publics don't get any or maybe very little at some different school systems for athletics PLUS in small rural publics the community is poor. Private school boosters and communities are NOT poor. They have money in their boosters walletts to pay for alot of stuff.

 

I have not seen Boyd , or CPA . I have seen the other 2 sometime back in the late 90's

However I have seen all of them win Championships.

[Bighurt]

old24eagle,

Be consistent. If you are going to complain that public schools do not receive tax money for athletics, then do not scoff when I say private schools do not get tax money for athletics either.

 

Indian,

You are better than that. Read who was complaining about not being able to compete. I believe you will see it was not me.

 

We keep going over the same stuff again and again.

[Baldcoach]

Your point #1 drives me crazy!

MAYBE just MAYBE your school doesn't have much cash ............. but you being in the Chattanooga area I find it hard to believe. I'm not calling you a liar because I have never been to Boyd so I don't know , I just find it hard to believe.

All of the Knoxville area privates with the exception of TKA which is in sevier county has the BEST fascilities ,practice equipment etc. You have to have some $$$$ for that. One K-town private has only had sports for 4-5 years and has already surpassed all small area publics and most larger publics in quality of fascilities and competiteveness.

I watched a game at FCS a couple of years ago that place is like a small college fascility , There are 4 and 5A schools around here that don't have the fascilities they do.

Quality practice fascilities , equipment , weightroom etc. Makes for a HUGE competitive edge.

 

 

You know a lot of this is simply not true. It is full of hyperbole. There is only 1 DI private in the K-ville area that is anywhere near as good as the publics are, and that is KnoxCatholic, who just can't seem to get passed Fulton to that championship game.

 

MOST D-1 privates run a deficit budget. ALL of them are non-profits. That doesn't mean that they can't raise money, nor does it mean that they can't build things. It does mean that to do so they have to have special campaigns to get the money given to them for specific purposes. The money that builds the buildings is NOT available for other things...it is given by people to build specific buildings. So to have enough money to go out and pay kids to go to school there the small privates would have to have a "Recruit the Best Athletes" campaign...I'm thinking I haven't seen that one yet.

 

Of course there are some publics that don't have nice facilities. What is the point? If you compare the worst public facilities to the best private facilities you are gonna win that argument every time. How about comparing the good privates with the good publics?

 

And having adequate facilities makes a huge difference over having inadequate facilities. Having new and very nice equipment really doesn't give much of an advantage over those who have older but workable equipment, it just looks nicer. I have yet to encounter any public schools near Knoxville that didn't have adequate training facilities...if your school doesn't, contact your school board and demand it. Amazingly, you will get it for free...the small privates would have had to raise that money and pay for it themselves.

[Baldcoach]

Poor privates. With all the fundraising they have to do to even field teams, an applicant pool that thins out all athletes except the 5.0 40 running backs and 150 pound linemen, you wonder how they ever win a game against a public school.

 

 

sarcasm...I get it. Points out how little you really know about the small privates. Also points our your fundamental mistake, that nicely maintained facilities = money = success on the field, or that success is always tied to size and speed.

 

Have you ever started a 150 pound lineman? I have...more than 1. Have you ever started a 5.0 40 running back? I have, more than one year. Last year when we played you guys I had a 145 pound 5.0 40 free safety as a starter. he started all year for us. In 02 and 03 our starting middle linebacker/offensive guard was a 5'10" 5.1 40 172 pounder. The guy next to him in 03 was his LITTLE brother. The other 2 linebackers were smaller than the 2 middle ones. When was the last time your linebackers averaged 161 pounds?

 

What happened to all those 6'2" 225 pound fast kids you ask? They evaporated (some recondensed at Baylor and McCallie lol), just like the cherry picking argument does when you look at it closely...

[Baldcoach]

I have ............. And the new K'town school is in our region and has the best fascilities in our region only having played sports for 4-5 seasons.WHY because they have $$$$$$$$ to build them.

 

I know the next words from baldy will be BBBButt you get all that FREE tax money ........BALONEY!! That tax money stops the minute you walk outside the school building. Virtually no tax money goes to support athletics in MOST public schools.

 

 

Baloney! The fields and lights are paid for with tax money. The electricity, plumbing, insurance, heating, maintenance and taxes on the property are paid for with tax money. Some schools want to upgrade their basic stuff so they raise money to do so...GREAT! But that doesn't mean that ALL of the basic stuff isn't available for free...up to and including transportation to and from games and referees and the salaries of the coaches.

 

And you keep comparing the newest private with schools that have been around for a while...of course their stuff is nicer...it is newer. That doesn't make it better, just newer. Talk to me in 10 years after their stuff has aged a bit. Compared with the schools that we play our facilities are somewhere in the middle...which is what I have found to be true of almost all DI privates.

[Baldcoach]

"Have you seen CPA or DCA or Ezell?"

 

hevent been to cpa, but have been to dca & ezell.

maybe, just maybe, someday we'll have facilities that nice.

 

"Where do you think that private schools get the money to pay for anything?"

 

i suppose you raise it from your parents just like we do.

what percentage of *your* target market makes under 20K a year?

 

lazarus rule of thumb: it's dang hard to raise money from people whose car is worth more than their house.

 

 

 

Wait a minute Laz, where the heck are you from? You are claiming that Ezell has much nicer facilities than you do (no offense to Ezell people, facilities are fine, just not as nice as CPA or GP), so much nicer that you hope and dream that "maybe, just maybe, someday we'll have facilities that nice."

 

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[Baldcoach]

I have argued this point a thousand times. I know you don't get tax money at privates if you want it go to a public school and quit whining. Publics don't get any or maybe very little at some different school systems for athletics PLUS in small rural publics the community is poor. Private school boosters and communities are NOT poor. They have money in their boosters walletts to pay for alot of stuff.

 

I have not seen Boyd , or CPA . I have seen the other 2 sometime back in the late 90's

However I have seen all of them win Championships.

 

 

 

So you are guessing they have great facilities because money = championships? You and Indian need to get together since you both seem to live in the "we would be great if we just had money///those guys are only better than us because we don't have money" world.

 

 

"Publics don't get any or maybe very little at some different school systems for athletics PLUS in small rural publics the community is poor. "

 

Are we now comparing the worst and poorest publics to the best and wealthiest privates? Ok, you win. I admit that the best, wealthiest privates have more money at their disposal than the poorest publics. I suppose that the only publics that the privates play are the poorest publics, so this argument has some validity??

 

And I suppose that since money makes all the difference between a poor and a championship program if we look at the publics who have won championships all of them will be wealthy publics with super great facilities and lots of money? Don't tell S. Pitt or TC or Fulton or Huntingdon...those guys obviously haven't been informed that you have to have tons of money and live in a wealthy area to be good. We wouldn't want them to feel bad about their Championships, would we?

[old24eagle]

Baloney! The fields and lights are paid for with tax money. The electricity, plumbing, insurance, heating, maintenance and taxes on the property are paid for with tax money. Some schools want to upgrade their basic stuff so they raise money to do so...GREAT! But that doesn't mean that ALL of the basic stuff isn't available for free...up to and including transportation to and from games and referees and the salaries of the coaches.

 

And you keep comparing the newest private with schools that have been around for a while...of course their stuff is nicer...it is newer. That doesn't make it better, just newer. Talk to me in 10 years after their stuff has aged a bit. Compared with the schools that we play our facilities are somewhere in the middle...which is what I have found to be true of almost all DI privates.

 

Lets see our first football team was started in 1989 by a group of parents in the community. Those parents were given the LAND only they then raised money for LIGHTS and for GRASS SEED and SEATING. Notice I didn't say locker room, field house , stadium , weight room ,or concession stand oh yea we didn't have any of those until about 2003 When parents and coaches finally raised enough money for some of that. We still don't have a visitors locker room . or a practice field of any type. Coaches Mow the field with their mowers and their gas and buy paint with money raised. Your right tax money pays for the light bill.

[old24eagle]

You know a lot of this is simply not true. It is full of hyperbole. There is only 1 DI private in the K-ville area that is anywhere near as good as the publics are, and that is KnoxCatholic, who just can't seem to get passed Fulton to that championship game.

 

MOST D-1 privates run a deficit budget. ALL of them are non-profits. That doesn't mean that they can't raise money, nor does it mean that they can't build things. It does mean that to do so they have to have special campaigns to get the money given to them for specific purposes. The money that builds the buildings is NOT available for other things...it is given by people to build specific buildings. So to have enough money to go out and pay kids to go to school there the small privates would have to have a "Recruit the Best Athletes" campaign...I'm thinking I haven't seen that one yet.

 

Of course there are some publics that don't have nice facilities. What is the point? If you compare the worst public facilities to the best private facilities you are gonna win that argument every time. How about comparing the good privates with the good publics?

 

And having adequate facilities makes a huge difference over having inadequate facilities. Having new and very nice equipment really doesn't give much of an advantage over those who have older but workable equipment, it just looks nicer. I have yet to encounter any public schools near Knoxville that didn't have adequate training facilities...if your school doesn't, contact your school board and demand it. Amazingly, you will get it for free...the small privates would have had to raise that money and pay for it themselves.

 

CAK isn't any good? They are very good last I checked. Grace Christian has made the playoffs the last 2 seasons with a 4 year old program. They too have better fascilities than any other team in the region. If those two are running in the red its because they spent 100 K on fields and fascilities.

[old24eagle]

old24eagle,

Look at the facilities at most small D1 private schools like Boyd, CPA, DCA and Ezell before you post. These schools have don't have opulent facilities like MBA, Knox Webb, Baylor and MUS.

 

Most small D1 private school do not have tons of money whether you believe it or not. Most struggle to pay their bills while keeping tuition at a reasonable level.

 

Look at the fascilities at Cosby , Unaka , Cloudland , North Greene , and other small 1A publics in rural counties. Before you start throwing those names out any of these schools would trade with any of yours in a heart beat.