Shot clock

[WestTennRaider]

I do not want to get into a huge debate on pro's and con's of the shot clock.  And I have not read every post on here, so forgive me if I repeat something someone else said.  But, I am Pro Shot Clock.

Below is just one example of many of why I like the shot clock.

The shot clock would separate good strategic coaches from bad ones.  Think about this...Your team is in foul trouble, you are down 2 with 45 seconds left.  You do not have to extend your defense to try and steal, possibly giving up an easy layup to the other team.  You do not have to foul to stop the clock and possibly lose one of your better players to fouling out, the team probably having the ball in their best free throw shooters hands and adding points to the score board. And if you get the stop then you get the last possession.  You just have to play defense for 30-35 seconds(Probably leading to the other team running the shot clock down and taking a bad percentage shot) and if you get a stop, then you have a possession to tie or win the game. 

Anyways, just one of many scenarios that could happen or not happen.  

[YouAlreadyKnow]

15 hours ago, WestTennRaider said:

I do not want to get into a huge debate on pro's and con's of the shot clock.  And I have not read every post on here, so forgive me if I repeat something someone else said.  But, I am Pro Shot Clock.

Below is just one example of many of why I like the shot clock.

The shot clock would separate good strategic coaches from bad ones.  Think about this...Your team is in foul trouble, you are down 2 with 45 seconds left.  You do not have to extend your defense to try and steal, possibly giving up an easy layup to the other team.  You do not have to foul to stop the clock and possibly lose one of your better players to fouling out, the team probably having the ball in their best free throw shooters hands and adding points to the score board. And if you get the stop then you get the last possession.  You just have to play defense for 30-35 seconds(Probably leading to the other team running the shot clock down and taking a bad percentage shot) and if you get a stop, then you have a possession to tie or win the game. 

Anyways, just one of many scenarios that could happen or not happen.  

Tons of scenarios like this. I'm for the shot clock

[threeball]

17 hours ago, WestTennRaider said:

I do not want to get into a huge debate on pro's and con's of the shot clock.  And I have not read every post on here, so forgive me if I repeat something someone else said.  But, I am Pro Shot Clock.

Below is just one example of many of why I like the shot clock.

The shot clock would separate good strategic coaches from bad ones.  Think about this...Your team is in foul trouble, you are down 2 with 45 seconds left.  You do not have to extend your defense to try and steal, possibly giving up an easy layup to the other team.  You do not have to foul to stop the clock and possibly lose one of your better players to fouling out, the team probably having the ball in their best free throw shooters hands and adding points to the score board. And if you get the stop then you get the last possession.  You just have to play defense for 30-35 seconds(Probably leading to the other team running the shot clock down and taking a bad percentage shot) and if you get a stop, then you have a possession to tie or win the game. 

Anyways, just one of many scenarios that could happen or not happen.  

I like the shot clock for the defensive purposes of it... there is no doubt that it will benefit defense much more than offense.... however, it is precisely these scenarios that make me think otherwise... Why would the offense "have to" give up possession.... that is the benefit of being up at the end of a game... you get a chance to control to ball (well coached, fundamental teams, with  a good strategic plan will do just this).  If the defense wants it, then they must do to get it.  They must earn the possession of the ball.  I don't think a rule should punish the team that has earned the lead in the first 31 mins and 15 seconds of the game, yet benefit the team who is behind... so they don't have to "extend" they defense for the last 45 secs of the game. 

Edited September 23, 2021 by threeball

[threeball]

I also hear some people say in these posts about a shot clock would separate good coaches from bad coaches... are bad coaches the only ones not wanting a shot clock?   I believe, that a shot clock actually would take an element of coaching away from the good coaches.  A shot clock would force all teams to play within a boxed pace of play.... which eliminates parts of strategy that is beneficial to the game.  

Before 1933, there was no 10-second rule for the ball to cross half court.  The rule has been beneficial for defenses.  In the early 2000's the NBA and FIBA changed it to 8 seconds while college, high school, middle, and elementary have kept it at 10 seconds.  Should all basketball levels also change that to 8 seconds? I don't think so.  What would be the benefit?  We don't need to box players and coaches into a certain pace of play.  Various styles and strategies are what makes our game unique, fun and beneficial to the masses.  It also allows good coaching strategies (either fast or slow pace of play).    

[dogtruth]

On 9/23/2021 at 10:50 AM, threeball said:

I also hear some people say in these posts about a shot clock would separate good coaches from bad coaches... are bad coaches the only ones not wanting a shot clock?   I believe, that a shot clock actually would take an element of coaching away from the good coaches.  A shot clock would force all teams to play within a boxed pace of play.... which eliminates parts of strategy that is beneficial to the game.  

Before 1933, there was no 10-second rule for the ball to cross half court.  The rule has been beneficial for defenses.  In the early 2000's the NBA and FIBA changed it to 8 seconds while college, high school, middle, and elementary have kept it at 10 seconds.  Should all basketball levels also change that to 8 seconds? I don't think so.  What would be the benefit?  We don't need to box players and coaches into a certain pace of play.  Various styles and strategies are what makes our game unique, fun and beneficial to the masses.  It also allows good coaching strategies (either fast or slow pace of play).    

I agree, well stated. A shot clock takes a strategy away from the great coaches especially late in the game.

[tradertwo]

On 9/22/2021 at 12:15 PM, warmachine7954 said:

The Shot Clock is not evolving the game. The shot clock's only purpose was to prevant teams from stalling and losing fans for professional sports. The NBA introduced it in 1954 the NCAA in 1985. 

I coached overseas with a shot clock in HS. In 2 seasons we never had a shot clock violation because the 35 sec clock was never in play because the teams, no matter how good or bad, they were were constantly taking quick shots. The team that I coached was bigger, more athletic, and stronger than every team we played. 2 seasons, 2 losses and destroyed just about everyone we played just because we physically out mathced people. We didn't have good basketball players or highly skilled players we were just bigger, faster, and stronger.

Before the shot clock teams could work the ball, make teams play defense, and play the game to give themselves a chance to win. When that went away the level of play went down and it became Darwin's Theory.

Absolutely the best post on the subject...coming from someone with firsthand experience with and without.

[tradertwo]

On 9/22/2021 at 3:55 PM, WestTennRaider said:

I do not want to get into a huge debate on pro's and con's of the shot clock.  And I have not read every post on here, so forgive me if I repeat something someone else said.  But, I am Pro Shot Clock.

Below is just one example of many of why I like the shot clock.

The shot clock would separate good strategic coaches from bad ones.  Think about this...Your team is in foul trouble, you are down 2 with 45 seconds left.  You do not have to extend your defense to try and steal, possibly giving up an easy layup to the other team.  You do not have to foul to stop the clock and possibly lose one of your better players to fouling out, the team probably having the ball in their best free throw shooters hands and adding points to the score board. And if you get the stop then you get the last possession.  You just have to play defense for 30-35 seconds(Probably leading to the other team running the shot clock down and taking a bad percentage shot) and if you get a stop, then you have a possession to tie or win the game. 

Anyways, just one of many scenarios that could happen or not happen.  

If you've been outcoached/outplayed for the first 31:15, why do you deserve the other team to be forced to allow you an "unearned" possession? I've seen many more games lost than won by stalling too early and having to maintain possession of the ball...there's the half court line, five second rule, and the option to trap from the zone, or man pressure to force turnovers. There's also the option to foul and gain several possessions in the last 45 seconds. That's why coaching isn't easy...there are multiple options in your scenario, and you want to remove most of them and make it as easy as following a recipe on the label of a soup can.

[TryNotToSuck]

On 9/15/2021 at 9:32 PM, Bkbfan4ever said:

I’m a coach too.  I’m also retired which makes me a fan.  I don’t want to go watch games and witness kids throwing up shots that have no chance of going in.  As three ball stated the NBA players can’t make those shots so what makes anyone think kids can.  This will only hurt the high school game 

I also don’t want to attend a high school basketball game and see a team hold the ball for 60+ seconds. It goes both ways.

[STANK]

I just hate to see a team hold the ball period! 

[WestTennRaider]

9 hours ago, tradertwo said:

If you've been outcoached/outplayed for the first 31:15, why do you deserve the other team to be forced to allow you an "unearned" possession? I've seen many more games lost than won by stalling too early and having to maintain possession of the ball...there's the half court line, five second rule, and the option to trap from the zone, or man pressure to force turnovers. There's also the option to foul and gain several possessions in the last 45 seconds. That's why coaching isn't easy...there are multiple options in your scenario, and you want to remove most of them and make it as easy as following a recipe on the label of a soup can.

Hahaha easy as following a recipe on the label of a soup can.  I never said that coaching was easy. I guess that is what all the college coach's do since they have a shot clock(Just follow the recipe). And just because you are down two with 45 seconds remaining, does not mean you have been out coached.  

[threeball]

9 hours ago, TryNotToSuck said:

I also don’t want to attend a high school basketball game and see a team hold the ball for 60+ seconds. It goes both ways.

It's a good thing that rarely happens, then... 

[captnoname]

On 9/17/2021 at 12:01 PM, CoachAnderson said:

I love the idea of implementing the ELAM ending, but I think it is way too radical for a lot of coaches.

Coach Troy Allen has used it for years at his summer team camp play days. 

I proposed use of the ELAM ending for boys and girls JV games this year in my league. I think using it on a trial basis (1 year) in JV is an appropriate place. It should also help with keeping JV games on schedule. Too many JV games are forced to play 6-7 min quarters or 16-20 minute running clock halves to stay on schedule. (***Speaking of staying on schedule, I will never understand the girls HC's that want their girls on the floor for 45 mins prior to their game. Trust me, the extra shooting time isn't going to help. LOL). It doesn't cost any extra money or require an extra person (most of the anti shot clockers chief complaint) and it makes the ending a lot more exciting.

I love the thought of doing the ELAM ending for the JV games.. I will need to bring that up to our coaches and see what they think. 

They are all in on the shot clock and I know they love the ELAM ending cause we talk about it during the summer.