Private- Public -Open Zone

[CougarBrown]

I have been an Alcoa alumni and fan for many years now. After watching the game tonight on tv, my buddy asked me a great question that I couldn't answer. Let's use Goodpasture as an example since we have played them in the final the last 3 years. The private schools have to use a multiplier, like 1.8. So Goodpasture has like 350 students and we have 510 or so. Well Goodpasture is a 1A size school that has to play 2A since everyone has to pay to go there. But Alcoa is a 2A school and anyone can pay to go there also. Anyone can pay and go to Goodpasture and anyone can pay and go to Alcoa. Why doesn't the open zone schools have to use a multiplier like the privates do. I know Alcoa and Maryville have this open zone and it looks like no one can stop them. It gets to be sad when we have to play these poor private schools that are 1A schools by numbers that have to play up and blow them away in the state championship. If Alcoa had a .8 multiplier and had to play in 3A and Maryville had a .8 multiplier and had to play in 5A, do you think that we would have more competition come playoff time?

 

 

I have never thought of that. A multiplier for open zone schools, seems fair to me but not as high as the private school multiplier. Maybe (.7 - 1.0) I did not know that Alcoa was open zone. Would Alcoa and Maryville be good if they were closed zone, probably so, just maybe not as good.

[rollredroll]

You may correct I believe I heard from a quality source that lipscomb was more closely been associated with bringing in families from out of state ensuring they have a house and jobs so the dormatory housing is probaly incorrect but I have heard of DI privates providing residence for out of state players.

Personaly I think it would be a disservice to the privates to put them all together because they are sepperated by who and who does not give athletic scholarships. Some teams put more emphasis on academia and could not afford to buy the best players I would say the best 2A team Alcoa played this year CAK would fall into this group.

 

 

You do realize that the DI private schools don't give financial aid because, for a lack of a better way of saying it, they can't afford it? It just isn't logical that private schools in such tight financial situations can "ensure" housing and jobs when they can't even subsidize education for athletes.

 

Quite frankly, many of the DI privates - which are much, much younger than many of their DII counterparts - have neither the general nor athletic history to be such a lure for families to pick up shop and move to Tennessee and have the kids play sports. The Mississippis and Alabamas of the world have plenty of Tennessee DI private-like schools in their own states. Now, those states may not have as prominent of boarding schools like a McCallie or Baylor (both about 100 years old with good academic reputations), and that's why those schools draw from out of state.

 

I know there are plenty of conspiracy theories about privates and how/where they get their students, but this whole "out-of-state" theory just doesn't hold water - on a individual basis here and there, perhaps, but as a widespread practice? No way. I love Tennessee, but our DI, non-boarding private schools/athletic programs just aren't that much of a dangling carrot to out-of-state families looking to send their teenage kids away for school/sports (and that's certainly not a slight to those schools; it's just that those schools serve a purpose and/or mission that has a demand easily met by native Tennesseans).

[tackle]

You may correct I believe I heard from a quality source that lipscomb was more closely been associated with bringing in families from out of state ensuring they have a house and jobs so the dormatory housing is probaly incorrect but I have heard of DI privates providing residence for out of state players.

Personaly I think it would be a disservice to the privates to put them all together because they are sepperated by who and who does not give athletic scholarships. Some teams put more emphasis on academia and could not afford to buy the best players I would say the best 2A team Alcoa played this year CAK would fall into this group.

 

 

The bad thing about this is someone will read this and actually believe and tell others that Lipscomb has boarding students and/or a job placement service for the parents of athletes. How ridiculous. If Lipscomb is recruiting, why do they start 2 guards that weigh in the neighborhood of 180 lbs. One of them was a reserve running back up until August.

 

Now they did hire a man about 10 years ago just to get his son to play quarterback. They went so far as to make Steve Flatt the president of the University just to get his son Ethan in the middle school. Ethan was a wide receive in middle school at Goodpasture. But Lipscomb knew he would develop into a major college quarterback and gave his dad a job to fulfull a quarterback need. Makes you wonder.... For anyone who wants to think Dr. Flatt got the job because of his son, let me know. I have several million dollars from a Nigerian Bank that I would like to put into your bank account. I just need to get your checking account number. /dry.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid="

[Filly2011]

You may correct I believe I heard from a quality source that lipscomb was more closely been associated with bringing in families from out of state ensuring they have a house and jobs so the dormatory housing is probaly incorrect but I have heard of DI privates providing residence for out of state players.

Personaly I think it would be a disservice to the privates to put them all together because they are sepperated by who and who does not give athletic scholarships. Some teams put more emphasis on academia and could not afford to buy the best players I would say the best 2A team Alcoa played this year CAK would fall into this group.

 

 

 

That really made me laugh out loud. Lipscomb has no housing for k-12 students anywhere on campus. I don't even think you could talk the admins into letting you let your kid stay there, since they normally fill the University dorms up all the time. I'd question the parent that would even think that. I'd have your source check his/her facts again, because I'm sure this isn't true.

[Ole3putt]

My stand.. Separate'em. but; we know that'll nerver happen.

[Gocart]

How much is yearly tuition for open-zoned public school?

[Bighurt]

I heard from a very reliable source that those dorms where Lipscomb houses their out-of-state recruits are right behind the campus dance club/bar. /wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=";)" border="0" alt="wink.gif" />

[ksgovols]

from FBGIRL

I would guess most privates also have limitations on the number of students they can accept (class size and teacher ratio) and your statement regarding privates drawing out of state students may only apply to privates that border other states. And practically any school (public or private) could have boosters that could employ the parent of any potential students in any area.

 

I would guess most privates also have limitations on the number of students they can accept (class size and teacher ratio)

 

yes but Good pasture may be able to take 100 students per class and Alcoa can take maybe thirty not really the same thing.

 

and your statement regarding privates drawing out of state students may only apply to privates that border other states

 

that applies to most privates I belive lipscomb has housing on campus where many students from out of state live.

 

And practically any school (public or private) could have boosters that could employ the parent of any potential students in any area.

 

you are correct but it happens much more often among the privates.

 

 

I'm trying to figure out where the rural publics in 2A are going to 'employ' parents. That might be true at the 4A or 5A level, but I don't think there's too many 1A-3A schools that can 'attract' athletes to their program by offering jobs to their parents unless it's within the school system which is generally the largest employer in most rural counties or in the top 2 or 3.

 

Coincidentally, 2A seems to also be where most of the non financial aid privates, open zoned publics and magnet schools seem to land.

[rollredroll]

I heard from a very reliable source that those dorms where Lipscomb houses their out-of-state recruits are right behind the campus dance club/bar. /wink.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=";)" border="0" alt="wink.gif" />

 

 

One of the funnier one-liners I've read on here in awhile. /biggrin.gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":D" border="0" alt="biggrin.gif" />

[Baldcoach]

All of the private schools should all agree to go DII and all of this would be solved. A public/private split is the only thing that will make people happy. I think that private teams should still play public and vice versa in non-region games, but not in the playoffs. Open zoned schools will continue to dominate because there are no quality private schools there. Who wouldn't agree that CPA vs. Goodpasture and Alcoa vs. Maryville for the state title games would be 1,000% better and more interesting than the last few years?

I wouldn't agree and a split doesn't make everyone happy, only those who are prejudiced against privates. There are lots of other solutions...

I'm trying to figure out where the rural publics in 2A are going to 'employ' parents. That might be true at the 4A or 5A level, but I don't think there's too many 1A-3A schools that can 'attract' athletes to their program by offering jobs to their parents unless it's within the school system which is generally the largest employer in most rural counties or in the top 2 or 3.Coincidentally, 2A seems to also be where most of the non financial aid privates, open zoned publics and magnet schools seem to land.

There are always ways to get players if you are dishonest. I assume teams are not. The sad thing is many assume that any DI private that has success is. It's prejudice.

[Baldcoach]

I have never thought of that. A multiplier for open zone schools, seems fair to me but not as high as the private school multiplier. Maybe (.7 - 1.0) I did not know that Alcoa was open zone. Would Alcoa and Maryville be good if they were closed zone, probably so, just maybe not as good.

 

 

YOur killing me cougar...who is your Math teacher? Surely You realize that a .7 multiplier actually REDUCES the size of the actual student body by 30% and a 1.0 doesn't change it? /thumb[1].gif" style="vertical-align:middle" emoid=":thumb:" border="0" alt="thumb[1].gif" />

[Baldcoach]

You didn't say it I did and its true of many of those Nashville schools do.

 

 

I had to lift my pants to avoid the...well, you know from your post about DLHS. Quit making stuff up LOL. You made me laugh so hard with this one I let go of my pants and now they are all stinky.