Should City School District have a Multiplier also

[Jet Pride]

What do these schools have in common: Greeneville, Alcoa, Maryville, Dobyns-Bennett, Science Hill, Tennessee High, Cleveland, Oak Ridge, Milan, Union City, Dyersburg. All have a rich history of consistently good football teams and all are city school systems that charge tuition to get into. These teams have a better W-L record against county schools than private schools have football. Maybe fairer to put an multiplier on city schools than on private schools in football. Looks to me that city school systems have unfair advantage.

[barb]

What do these schools have in common: Greeneville, Alcoa, Maryville, Dobyns-Bennett, Science Hill, Tennessee High, Cleveland, Oak Ridge, Milan, Union City, Dyersburg. All have a rich history of consistently good football teams and all are city school systems that charge tuition to get into. These teams have a better W-L record against county schools than private schools have football. Maybe fairer to put an multiplier on city schools than on private schools in football. Looks to me that city school systems have unfair advantage.

Gee would you not then have to determine how many of those tuition students play tssaa sanctioned sports? In private schools, all athletes pay tuition...if you apply a multiplier to any public school system, you will have to assume the liability for the law suits filed on behalf of the majority of student athletes in these programs that are being penalized. If we follow your logic, why then is Greeneville so dominate in Greene County. The 4 county schools there have an open enrollment policy that is tuition free for any student that resides in Greene County, even those within the city limits. All of those programs you described have another thing in common...they all are well supported financially and have strong Booster support.

Edited June 22, 2011 by barb

[STARSNBARS]

What do these schools have in common: Greeneville, Alcoa, Maryville, Dobyns-Bennett, Science Hill, Tennessee High, Cleveland, Oak Ridge, Milan, Union City, Dyersburg. All have a rich history of consistently good football teams and all are city school systems that charge tuition to get into. These teams have a better W-L record against county schools than private schools have football. Maybe fairer to put an multiplier on city schools than on private schools in football. Looks to me that city school systems have unfair advantage.

 

 

OK Jett Pryed....Cents Mairvul's allreddy 6A...Doo we go strait intwo tha SEC???....

[smeagle1]

Gee would you not then have to determine how many of those tuition students play tssaa sanctioned sports? In private schools, all athletes pay tuition...if you apply a multiplier to any public school system, you will have to assume the liability for the law suits filed on behalf of the majority of student athletes in these programs that are being penalized. If we follow your logic, why then is Greeneville so dominate in Greene County. The 4 county schools there have an open enrollment policy that is tuition free for any student that resides in Greene County, even those within the city limits. All of those programs you described have another thing in common...they all are well supported financially and have strong Booster support.

 

barb,

 

I do think the situation in Greene County is different. If it is open enrollment and kids can switch between any of the schools I think that's okay, as the people that live in the county are paying taxes for all of them. I hate to single out any of the others but I have to as I know more about Alcoa than any of the other ones mentioned.

 

So here we go. Alcoa has a tuition of $500 and it only allows a limited number of tuition paying students. Last years cost per student in Alcoa City Schools was right at $6,000. So someone is subsidizing almost $5,500 for an out of zone student to attend Alcoa. What's the difference between this and a private school doing the same thing? If they want to do this they should be in the private school division. Now in fairness some money is received from the state and federal government for each student so my guess is the subsidy is somewhat less than $5,500 but not $500.

 

As for the strong booster programs I'm not sure how that factors in unless it's the booster programs that are subsidizing the difference between pay and cost. Follow the money

[barb]

barb,

 

I do think the situation in Greene County is different. If it is open enrollment and kids can switch between any of the schools I think that's okay, as the people that live in the county are paying taxes for all of them. I hate to single out any of the others but I have to as I know more about Alcoa than any of the other ones mentioned.

 

So here we go. Alcoa has a tuition of $500 and it only allows a limited number of tuition paying students. Last years cost per student in Alcoa City Schools was right at $6,000. So someone is subsidizing almost $5,500 for an out of zone student to attend Alcoa. What's the difference between this and a private school doing the same thing? If they want to do this they should be in the private school division. Now in fairness some money is received from the state and federal government for each student so my guess is the subsidy is somewhat less than $5,500 but not $500.

 

As for the strong booster programs I'm not sure how that factors in unless it's the booster programs that are subsidizing the difference between pay and cost. Follow the money

So who subsidizes the rest of the students cost of attendance...I'd wager not every parent of an Alcoa zones student pays city property taxes. And I'm sure those who do pay property taxes don't pay anywhere close to $6000.

 

I'm sure Jet doesn't really think these schools should have a multiplier as much as he thinks the practice should be abolished by the TSSAA. Unfortunately, this would have to impact every ooz student, regardless of their situation, not just these tuition students. They would have to have a zero-tolerance policy for ooz athletes. Otherwise, they would just find another way to circumvent the rules.

Now boosters..surely I don't have to explain the value of an active Booster club to a team's success. Don't be obtuse. Boosters raise thousands of dollars annually for equipment, uniforms, as well as additional coaches stipends and facility upgrades.

If anything inappropriate were occurring, rest assured it would have already been exposed...particularly at Alcoa where the ooz target has been painted on their backs for several years now. But you do have a point about the money...it takes a considerable infusion of cash into a program to acheive success. I'd say SM is a good example of the best money can buy...facilities, equipment,coaches, etc.

Edited June 22, 2011 by barb

[Red Rebels]

So here we go. Alcoa has a tuition of $500 and it only allows a limited number of tuition paying students. Last years cost per student in Alcoa City Schools was right at $6,000. So someone is subsidizing almost $5,500 for an out of zone student to attend Alcoa. What's the difference between this and a private school doing the same thing? If they want to do this they should be in the private school division. Now in fairness some money is received from the state and federal government for each student so my guess is the subsidy is somewhat less than $5,500 but not $500.

 

 

 

I know many tuition paying Alcoa students who don't play football.

[barb]

I know many tuition paying Alcoa students who don't play football.

Yes so does Greeneville but that seems to be irrelevant

[smeagle1]

I know many tuition paying Alcoa students who don't play football.

 

So how many total tuition paying students does Alcoa have and how many are playing sports?

[barb]

So how many total tuition paying students does Alcoa have and how many are playing sports?

I'm pretty sure some of that information is considered confidential. In Greeneville city schools there are 2700 students in 6 schools and as of 2010, 660 of them were tuition. One elementary school had 53% of their enrollment OOZ tuition students...nearly 200 kids. Clearly, there has to be other reasons besides athletics for such a large number of elementary school kids to enroll in any school system, much less a single school. These kids will likely remain in the city system through high school, and yes many will play sports.So go take your "pay-to-play" crap and stuff it.They are there for the academics. Interestingly, tuition enrollment was down last year, a decrease attributed to annexation and more families moving into the city.

[THSVikings2004]

What do these schools have in common: Greeneville, Alcoa, Maryville, Dobyns-Bennett, Science Hill, Tennessee High, Cleveland, Oak Ridge, Milan, Union City, Dyersburg. All have a rich history of consistently good football teams and all are city school systems that charge tuition to get into. These teams have a better W-L record against county schools than private schools have football. Maybe fairer to put an multiplier on city schools than on private schools in football. Looks to me that city school systems have unfair advantage.

 

You think it's better to place a multiplier on schools that might not even have a tuition student on a team rather than place it on schools where all students there pay tuition or receive financial aid?

 

A lot of those schools have been around a long, long time...longer than all of their county counterparts. Some of them had 50 or 60 rich years of history before the county schools were even built. If they have a tuition student there's nothing wrong or illegal about it. Might be a better idea to talk to the county school boards and convince them to make it easier for students to go to that school if they want. But, I've seen some of those county schools and there are many reasons why they're struggling. Changing zoning policies won't turn teams like Heritage or WB into teams like Maryville or Alcoa.

 

Fairness by definition would be something that is free from injustice. The schools above aren't doing anything wrong or illegal. Are all teams equal? No, some teams have 100 players on the roster, some have a top notch coaching staff, lifting program, and elite youth programs in place. Some teams have college-like stadiums with turf and even a jumbotron. Some players have their names on the back of their jerseys. Some of the schools you mentioned have at least one of the things I mentioned (Science Hill has a jumbotron). Those perks, along with winning, can influence kids to come out and play for them, but do they need multipliers for that as well?

[REBELRON]

Maryville and Alcoa being able to get Tuition kids is an advantage. That is a fact. But! The main reason both those teams are doing so well is because of their coaching staffs.

 

Alcoa hasn't always been this dominant. I remember years where they had losing records. On this run they have been on Jon Reid helped get it started by putting in the weight training. Getting Bryan Nix was huge also. Nix was a former Maryville player who played under Hammontree. Richard Gamble is a fine coach. Gary Rankin is a huge upgrade from Jon Reid. Rocky Riley and Gossett have been great additions to the Tornado staff.

 

As of Maryville I thought 30 years ago after Ted Wilson left Rebel football would never be the same. Maryville was darn good in the 70s. Between 1978 and 1998 Maryville didn't win no state titles. In matter of fact Maryville had several 5-5 seasons. Tim Hammontree got Maryville on the right track by bringing in Discipline and weight training. Hiring George Quarles was huge. Hammontree helped get it started but George Quarles helped elevate it. GQ hiring Jim Gaylor from Clinton was huge. George Quarles,Jim Gaylor and David Ellis are great,great football coaches. The other guys are really good also. Wouldn't trade Maryville's staff for anyone elses.

[snoball5278]

I'm pretty sure some of that information is considered confidential. In Greeneville city schools there are 2700 students in 6 schools and as of 2010, 660 of them were tuition. One elementary school had 53% of their enrollment OOZ tuition students...nearly 200 kids. Clearly, there has to be other reasons besides athletics for such a large number of elementary school kids to enroll in any school system, much less a single school. These kids will likely remain in the city system through high school, and yes many will play sports.So go take your "pay-to-play" crap and stuff it.They are there for the academics. Interestingly, tuition enrollment was down last year, a decrease attributed to annexation and more families moving into the city.

real mature barb, anyone that disagrees with you can just stuff it? what are you a 13 y/o girl? you gonna take your barbies and go home if everyone doesn't accept your opinion as the gospel?

Edited June 23, 2011 by snoball5278