Fayetteville to forfeit 6 wins

[PullinGuard]

15 minutes ago, tradertwo said:

I get your point also, but we're talking about an independent organization here. Membership is voluntary... you have to petition to join, pay a fee, and agree to abide by their by-laws (policy) in order to be recognized and compete against other member schools for a championship. Fayetteville is perfectly within their rights to have a football team consisting of ineligible (per TSSAA) kids if they choose, but TSSAA also has the right to disallow them from competing in their association while playing the ineligible player(s).

  This isn't a case of one school being singled out or unfairly punished, this is one school violating a long standing policy and receiving a standardized punishment for it, which they may appeal. If Fayetteville doesn't wish to follow TSSAA's policy, they are in no way forced to do so by law, but by the same logic, TSSAA isn't forced to recognize Fayetteville as a member, or to allow them to compete for a championship.

   

   

Once again, the rules matter. 

***

Section 3. Regardless of whether a member school has sought a hearing under Section 2, the school may appeal any decision of the Executive Director to the Board of Control. If the decision of the Executive Director is sustained, the school making the appeal shall defray the expenses for the meeting of the Board of Control in case a special meeting of the Board is called to consider the appeal.

***

The school MAY appeal.  A hearing and/or less formal appeal is 100% voluntary and there is no requirement to do so. 

Further, in the Untied States, you cannot tell anyone that they cannot seek relief from a court of law if they choose.  

 

[Varo]

9 minutes ago, PullinGuard said:

Once again, the rules matter. 

***

Section 3. Regardless of whether a member school has sought a hearing under Section 2, the school may appeal any decision of the Executive Director to the Board of Control. If the decision of the Executive Director is sustained, the school making the appeal shall defray the expenses for the meeting of the Board of Control in case a special meeting of the Board is called to consider the appeal.

***

The school MAY appeal.  A hearing and/or less formal appeal is 100% voluntary and there is no requirement to do so. 

Further, in the Untied States, you cannot tell anyone that they cannot seek relief from a court of law if they choose.  

 

Where in the by-laws is the provision for the Assistant Director to assume the duties of the Executive Director and initiate investigations and pass judgement on a member school in his absence?  I have not come across any verbiage allowing him to supersede the ED's authority or responsibilities.

[Guy001]

45 minutes ago, tradertwo said:

I get your point also, but we're talking about an independent organization here. Membership is voluntary... you have to petition to join, pay a fee, and agree to abide by their by-laws (policy)

   

So it's like a College (or maybe even a Fraternity).  Those organizations are never in court.

Edited October 30, 2019 by Guy001

[CaptainJackRackam]

3 minutes ago, Guy001 said:

So it's like a College (or maybe even a Fraternity).  No one ever takes them to court

I’d say when you do it puts a HUGE BULLSEYE on your schools sports programs!

[Guy001]

Just now, CaptainJackRackam said:

I’d say when you do it puts a HUGE BULLSEYE on your schools sports programs!

I'd agree. That may be true as well.

[CaptainJackRackam]

2 minutes ago, Guy001 said:

I'd agree. That may be true as well.

And that’s regardless if the school wins or the TSSAA wins!

[Guy001]

Anyone know the basis of the restraining order...or how exactly does that work?

[Yeti]

9 hours ago, Vandychris said:

So,with a Nov 13 court date, this team will be in the playoffs. So what happens on Nov 13 if the court says Fayetteville is in the wrong and the kid is in fact ineligible. You now have a situation of a team being in the playoffs that shouldnt have been. Another team that woudl be in their place is left out and has no recourse. That is a crappy way for FHS to be doing business rather than simply going through the appeals process. Seems they fear the TSSAA has everything they need to keep the original forfeiture in place.

TSSAA could sue and win handily if ruled in their favor and Fayetteville gets in when they shouldn't have. I mean if you agree to join and abide by their rules, and you decide not to abide by the rules be it accidental or negligence what do you think they outcome would be. I'd set an example out of them in the form of $ which is what was stated they care about anyhow. I'd have to know without a shadow of a doubt I was correct not only in my eyes but a lawyers eyes that was fully aware of the situation before I'd have done the contempt thing. How much is playoffs worth to a kid and his team, coaches, and family even in the form of memories. I'm not for either side, but I think rules are in place to make order. One of these institutions is gonna have an eye opening experience out of this. I'm not sure it's not gonna be Fayetteville.

9 hours ago, PullinGuard said:

None direct.  Grew up there, don’t live there now, went to school in the County system exclusively.  Quite honestly, ‘hated’ City growing up  

I like law, logic, reason, football. That’s about it.  My position is based primarily on a belief that their ruling is logically at odds with their rules. 

Law, logic, and reason are things if done correctly make for easier ways of life or an order of things that puts things on a path that shouldn't normally need questioned. One of those is missing from either the TSSAA or the school in this situation.

[RocketHouse]

There isn't time to go through the appeals process that TSSAA is in charge of and  get in the playoffs.  The more severe penalty is missing the playoffs and not the fine. What if FHS gets a ruling in their favor AFTER the playoffs begin? They get their $600 refunded and still missed the playoffs.

IF TSSAA had ruled correctly in September then Fayetteville would have had time to go through the appeals process. Instead TSSAA revisited an old case and made a ruling 6 days before the final game of the season. As yet they have not revealed any new bombshell evidence that changed their decision. 

TSSAA immediately scrubbed FHS' wins and region standing. Time was of the essence and after a weekend of deliberation with legal counsel the school system decided this was their best recourse. 

[Crock1615]

53 minutes ago, Varo said:

Where in the by-laws is the provision for the Assistant Director to assume the duties of the Executive Director and initiate investigations and pass judgement on a member school in his absence?  I have not come across any verbiage allowing him to supersede the ED's authority or responsibilities.

i think this has got to be the key to the court action by fayetteville,  That the assistant director doesn't have the authority to overrule what the director did on sept 6. 

I think this would be the only legal leg they have to stand on.  

[PullinGuard]

28 minutes ago, Imthayeti said:

TSSAA could sue and win handily if ruled in their favor and Fayetteville gets in when they shouldn't have. I mean if you agree to join and abide by their rules, and you decide not to abide by the rules be it accidental or negligence what do you think they outcome would be. I'd set an example out of them in the form of $ which is what was stated they care about anyhow. I'd have to know without a shadow of a doubt I was correct not only in my eyes but a lawyers eyes that was fully aware of the situation before I'd have done the contempt thing. How much is playoffs worth to a kid and his team, coaches, and family even in the form of memories. I'm not for either side, but I think rules are in place to make order. One of these institutions is gonna have an eye opening experience out of this. I'm not sure it's not gonna be Fayetteville.

Law, logic, and reason are things if done correctly make for easier ways of life or an order of things that puts things on a path that shouldn't normally need questioned. One of those is missing from either the TSSAA or the school in this situation.

Boiled down to the simplest of terms, here the crux of the matter.  This relates to the definition of ‘territory’  

If FHS is a ‘system-wide’ school, FHS is 100% correct and the TSSAA is 100% wrong. 

If FHS is a single school in a multi-school system with rigid zoning that is defined by bus routes, the TSSAA is correct. 

FHS is the only HS in the system.  It is an absurd notion that it isn’t a ‘system-wide’ school.   

Incidentally, there is a similar argument for Huntland. There are two HS in the system, but there is open zoning, so HHS is a system-wide school. That’s why Winchester kids can play there, no problem, even though the bus doesn’t run by their house.  There are probably four dozen other examples around the state. 

Edited October 30, 2019 by PullinGuard

[Crock1615]

4 minutes ago, PullinGuard said:

Boiled down to the simplest of terms, here the crux of the matter.  This relates to the definition of ‘territory’  

If FHS is a ‘system-wide’ school, FHS is 100% correct and the TSSAA is 100% wrong. 

If FHS is a single school in a multi-school system with rigid zoning that is defined by bus routes, the TSSAA is correct. 

FHS is the only HS in the system.  It is an absurd notion that it isn’t a ‘system-wide’ school.   

So would this mean that Fayetteville City and Lincoln County are overlapping districts?   

Isn't Lincoln County High School in Fayetteville?

Can students inside the city limits of fayetteville attend lincoln county high school?

Do lincoln county buses run inside the city limits of fayetteville?

Or are there separate zones for each school?

 

I am not familiar with this area at all, but according to google maps the schools are less than 2 miles apart.

 

Edited October 30, 2019 by Crock1615