Freshman State Title Chances

[JIII]

17 minutes ago, Ummmno said:

That's a weak argument. It just simply does work that way.

 

What you're saying is its absolutely impossible for him to have gone and trained in the off season and gotten better because he doesn't have Cleveland's strength of schedule.

That’s exactly how it works. He beat the Sebron kid from Blackman 7-5. That’s his best win all year so far. He very well might be training in the off season and working hard. I have no idea but when that water gets deep and he hasn’t been in that end of the pool the view is a lot different. 

[Ummmno]

8 minutes ago, JIII said:

That’s exactly how it works. He beat the Sebron kid from Blackman 7-5. That’s his best win all year so far. He very well might be training in the off season and working hard. I have no idea but when that water gets deep and he hasn’t been in that end of the pool the view is a lot different. 

I'm not sure you could possibly saying anything dumber. Take a bow.

 

Because someone doesn't have cleveland's strength of schedule its impossible for them to improve. Got it. 

[JIII]

2 minutes ago, Ummmno said:

I'm not sure you could possibly saying anything dumber. Take a bow.

 

Because someone doesn't have cleveland's strength of schedule its impossible for them to improve. Got it. 

Here is strength of schedule argument.

Last 8 out of 10 State titles Cleveland

9 out of 14 individual finalist last year with 6 Champs.

You think think that is happening by chance? Walker by decision at a minimum. 

[Ummmno]

12 minutes ago, JIII said:

Here is strength of schedule argument.

Last 8 out of 10 State titles Cleveland

9 out of 14 individual finalist last year with 6 Champs.

You think think that is happening by chance? Walker by decision at a minimum. 

Cleveland is better every year than the rest of the state because they have the best youth program in the state, every year.

 

They didn't do anything crazy, didnt go to Beast of the East, Poweraide, nothing outside the norm except a dual tourney in NC where in the finals they beat...wait for it...Baylor, a TN school. They wrestled the same schedule, for the most part, that the rest of the top in the state did. 

 

Everybody knows that successful high school programs start with successful youth programs. Come on now. 

 

Edited February 9, 2022 by Ummmno

[HCWCCoachV]

47 minutes ago, Ummmno said:

Cleveland is better every year than the rest of the state because they have the best youth program in the state, every year.

 

They didn't do anything crazy, didnt go to Beast of the East, Poweraide, nothing outside the norm except a dual tourney in NC where in the finals they beat...wait for it...Baylor, a TN school. They wrestled the same schedule, for the most part, that the rest of the top in the state did. 

 

Everybody knows that successful high school programs start with successful youth programs. Come on now. 

 

Chase Walker went to Beast of the East...

[PackMentality]

1 hour ago, JIII said:

That’s exactly how it works. He beat the Sebron kid from Blackman 7-5. That’s his best win all year so far. He very well might be training in the off season and working hard. I have no idea but when that water gets deep and he hasn’t been in that end of the pool the view is a lot different. 

Also, I realize that the transitive property rule does not always work in sports but for comparison ZB beat Seabron 12-2 a month earlier than Hicks beat Seabron 7-5. The thread is about which freshman has the best chance to win a state title.  I think in AA it is Walker for sure - and frankly it is almost always the case that the easiest weight for a freshman to win is 106. The Hicks kid is gonna be a good one but I don’t see him beating Walker this year.  But hey, that’s why they wrestle the matches.  Upsets are always possible.  All that said, the room does matter.  Wrestling good kids each day makes you better.  Both Cleveland and WC have great rooms - especially at the lower weights.

[Ummmno]

7 minutes ago, HCWCCoachV said:

Chase Walker went to Beast of the East...

At this point we're talking about Cleveland as a whole. Their schedule isn't what makes them the best team in the state. Again, its their youth and middle school programs.

 

I agree Wilson Central wrestles a lighter schedule than Cleveland. However, Jill's comment was Hicks is not able to ever get better or beat Walker because Cleveland's schedule is tougher. Then went on to say that its because of their schedule they win titles. Which is absolutely asinine.

 

Edited February 9, 2022 by Ummmno

[greendoor]

1 hour ago, JIII said:

That’s exactly how it works. He beat the Sebron kid from Blackman 7-5. That’s his best win all year so far. He very well might be training in the off season and working hard. I have no idea but when that water gets deep and he hasn’t been in that end of the pool the view is a lot different. 

Makes you wonder how Signal Mountain 106 in his shallow pool beat a Greeneville kid who spent all year in the deep end. Cool pool analogy thanks for using it.

[HCWCCoachV]

39 minutes ago, Ummmno said:

At this point we're talking about Cleveland as a whole. Their schedule isn't what makes them the best team in the state. Again, its their youth and middle school programs.

 

I agree Wilson Central wrestles a lighter schedule than Cleveland. However, Jill's comment was Hicks is not able to ever get better or beat Walker because Cleveland's schedule is tougher. Then went on to say that its because of their schedule they win titles. Which is absolutely asinine.

 

How are we talking about Cleveland as a whole but not WC as a whole? You literally just said in an earlier post that we don't know what Hicks has done to prepare for this tournament but when we tell you what Chase has done, that's irrelevant because Clevelands whole team didn't go?

[Ummmno]

14 minutes ago, HCWCCoachV said:

How are we talking about Cleveland as a whole but not WC as a whole? You literally just said in an earlier post that we don't know what Hicks has done to prepare for this tournament but when we tell you what Chase has done, that's irrelevant because Clevelands whole team didn't go?

There's two different conversations going on here. 

 

1. They're saying that Hicks doesn't have a chance because Walker wrestled a tougher schedule. Which is wrong.

 

2. They're saying that Cleveland wins titles solely because, again, they wrestle a tougher schedule. Which is also wrong. 

[fooseball95]

There’s no doubt that Cleveland’s success is because of HCWC and Cleveland middle. But also wrestling the tougher competition makes you better individually and as a team. With that being said, I do believe that’s why Wilson Central always seems to run into trouble at state. Does this mean one kid that doesn’t wrestle as tough of a schedule doesn’t have a chance against one that does? No……but it certainly doesn’t help. 

[Rasslinking]

25 minutes ago, Ummmno said:

There's two different conversations going on here. 

 

1. They're saying that Hicks doesn't have a chance because Walker wrestled a tougher schedule. Which is wrong.

 

2. They're saying that Cleveland wins titles solely because, again, they wrestle a tougher schedule. Which is also wrong. 

1) Nobody said he didn’t have a chance……they just said he hasn’t wrestled anyone very tough…..which from looking at the results….is accurate

2) Cleveland does win titles bc of their schedule….. if you follow what the Cleveland program does every year at every level of their program, they are traveling all over the country, and that doesn’t change in HS

There are a lot of great youth and MS kids that don’t continue to have success in HS bc of the lack of competition…… that is FACTS.

 

Hicks is tough and he’s definitely top 3 in the weight, top 4 if Cleveland could enter both kids.