Time for a change

[larry]

QUOTE(JaxMan @ May 26 2007 - 08:36 PM) 826467765[/snapback]Let me start by saying I am a private supporter...I will acknowledge there are some advantages privates have...I would also submit that all schools have advantages and disadvantages...size, economic ability to support team and booster club, parent support, public schools that have no tutiton to pay...but I will never deny that there are advantages to private schools...What I resent is when someone accuses all privates of recruiting or giving aid to atheletes...I can only speak for JCS...

 

How muich are those parking places again? 30 at $1,000 each.

[JaxMan]

that is correct...what's your point...I said we have some advantages...we have fans who can pay it(one of our advantages)...it buys equipment for all our sports...not sure what it has to do with me favoring a split to 3 classes...but you are correct...corporate sponsors who make a $1,000 donation to our booster club get two season passes to all games, a stadium seat, cap and a parking spot close to the gate...this may say as much about why we can't find common ground as anything...as a private supporter I come out in favor of a plan that gives small publics what they want...and instead of agreement or dialogue a public school supporter wants to make a dig at how we raise money for our program...

[Indian]

QUOTE(JaxMan @ May 26 2007 - 09:20 PM) 826467803[/snapback]First the ... is just my habit when posting...sorry if it bothered you...as to diluting competition...I think 3 classes would be better than putting non-aid privates with aid giving ones...as I said I am fine staying where we are, but if a change has to come I prefer 3 classes to non-aid and aid giving privates in the same class...as to travel expense...again if we stay where we are fine...but if we have to change the travel would be about the same in 3 classes as 2...either way the travel will increase...please note...I said I am fine with the current system...but if change has to come I prefer 3 classes over 2...just one man's opinion...most of all...I think we have to begin looking for solutions and stop arguing...and that is mostly what I see on this board...privates being accused of cheating...publics being accused of whinning...I think we are smart enough to find a solution if we stop arguing and work together

 

 

 

There could easily be a Division II with aid and non-aid classes. Jackson's longest district drive in this would be about 45 minutes. Class A could be non-aid schools. Take the current Class A and AA teams.

 

District 1:

Knox. Grace (Knoxville), Knoxville Christian (Knoxville), Walker Academy (Knoxville), CAK (Knoxville), Knoxville Catholic (Knoxville)

 

District: 2: Chatt. Grace (Chattanooga), Silverdale (Chattanooga), Temple (Chattanooga), Boyd-Buchanan (Chattanooga), Chatt. Christian (Chattanooga), Notre Dame (Chattanooga)

 

District 3: Boyd Christian (McMinnville), Middle TN Chr. (Murfreesboro), Columbia Academy (Columbia), Friendship Christian (Lebanon), Mt. Juliet Christian (Mt. Juliet), Zion Christian (Columbia)

 

District: 4:

Clarksville Academy (Clarksville), Nashville Christian (Nashville), DCA (Nashville), Goodpasture (Madison), CPA (Nashville), David Lipscomb (Nashville), Ezell-Harding (Antioch), Franklin Road Academy (Nashville)

 

District 5 Carroll Academy (Huntingdon), Jackson Christian (Jackson), Trinity Christian (Jackson), Fayette Academy (Somerville), Univ. School Jackson (Jackson)

 

That's five districts, not a round number of four, but something could be worked out for a playoff format.

 

Class AA could be the smaller aid schools, Class AAA the larger aid schools. Division II is going from one class in most sports to two, that will help a lot of small schools which haven't been able to compete.

 

You could also combine them all the privates, aid and non-aid, and have two classes since most of the bullies being worried about like McCallie and Brentwood Academy would be in the larger class anyway. I doubt Davidson Academy, Bishop Byrne, and teams like that would have that much of an advantage if any over the non-aid schools.

[therock]

Did noone like my idea of putting them all in AAA. I know AAA wouldnt like it.

[FCSprideatUT]

The best argument i have heard (i don't agree with it) is that if the TSSAA forces all privates into their own division, then what is the motivation for the privates to even stay in the TSSAA? that is why i don't think you will ever see the TSSAA institute a split. They gave BA and other DII schools a choice to change their scholarships or go to their own division BA and the rest chose. But the TSSAA knows that if they say "no choice about it you have to move to DII private section" then they have a high chance of loosing all private schools. While this is not a huge amount of the teams, nor a huge amount of the TSSAA's money, as we all know the TSSAA is not going to willingly give up a cent, let alone a group of schools that generate at least 15% of the TSSAA's money...

[Indian]

From the other post, here's what you could have with all private schools in Division II. Baylor, etc, would be divided from the rest. I used a cutoff of 500, it could be a little more or less. The large class teams will make up Division II Large in a two-class Division II starting next season. The teams in bold in Class A are currently Division II. I could see Notre Dame and Lipscomb playing up, since they're both over 500 in population. If you're looking at a three-class Division II, put the ones in bold in their own class.

 

Class A

District 1:

Knox. Grace (Knoxville), Knoxville Christian (Knoxville), Walker Academy (Knoxville), CAK (Knoxville), Knoxville Catholic (Knoxville), King’s Academy. I understand there's a small school in Maryville that will be joining the TSSAA soon.

 

District: 2: Chatt. Grace (Chattanooga), Silverdale (Chattanooga), Temple (Chattanooga), Boyd-Buchanan (Chattanooga), Chatt. Christian (Chattanooga), Collegedale Academy, David Brainerd. Hamilton Heights plans to join soon, I've read.

 

District 3: Boyd Christian (McMinnville), Middle TN Chr. (Murfreesboro), Columbia Academy (Columbia), Friendship Christian (Lebanon), Mt. Juliet Christian (Mt. Juliet), Zion Christian (Columbia), St. Andrews-Sewanee, Webb (Bell Buckle)

 

District: 4:

Clarksville Academy (Clarksville), Nashville Christian (Nashville), DCA (Nashville), Goodpasture (Madison), CPA (Nashville), Ezell-Harding (Antioch), Franklin Road Academy (Nashville), Davidson Academy, USN

 

District 5 Carroll Academy (Huntingdon), Jackson Christian (Jackson), Trinity Christian (Jackson), Fayette Academy (Somerville), Univ. School Jackson (Jackson)

 

District 6 Bishop Byrne, First Assembly, Immaculate Conception, Lausanne, Lighthouse Christian, Memphis Catholic

Rossville Christian, St. George’s, SBEC, Tipton-Rosemark

 

 

Class AA:

East: Baylor, GPS, McCallie, Webb, Notre Dame

 

Middle: BGA, Brentwood Academy, Ensworth, Ryan, Harpeth Hall, John Paul II, MBA, St. Cecilia, Lipscomb

 

West: Briarcrest, CBHS, ECS, Hutchison, MUS, St. Agnes, St. Benedict, St. Mary’s

 

What would be so bad about this set-up?

[hasbeen7]

QUOTE(Indian @ May 27 2007 - 12:39 AM) 826467908[/snapback]From the other post, here's what you could have with all private schools in Division II. Baylor, etc, would be divided from the rest. I used a cutoff of 500, it could be a little more or less. The large class teams will make up Division II Large in a two-class Division II starting next season. The teams in bold in Class A are currently Division II. I could see Notre Dame and Lipscomb playing up, since they're both over 500 in population.

 

Class A

District 1:

Knox. Grace (Knoxville), Knoxville Christian (Knoxville), Walker Academy (Knoxville), CAK (Knoxville), Knoxville Catholic (Knoxville), King’s Academy. I understand there's a small school in Maryville that will be joining the TSSAA soon.

 

District: 2: Chatt. Grace (Chattanooga), Silverdale (Chattanooga), Temple (Chattanooga), Boyd-Buchanan (Chattanooga), Chatt. Christian (Chattanooga), Collegedale Academy, David Brainerd. Hamilton Heights plans to join soon, I've read.

 

District 3: Boyd Christian (McMinnville), Middle TN Chr. (Murfreesboro), Columbia Academy (Columbia), Friendship Christian (Lebanon), Mt. Juliet Christian (Mt. Juliet), Zion Christian (Columbia), St. Andrews-Sewanee, Webb (Bell Buckle)

 

District: 4:

Clarksville Academy (Clarksville), Nashville Christian (Nashville), DCA (Nashville), Goodpasture (Madison), CPA (Nashville), Ezell-Harding (Antioch), Franklin Road Academy (Nashville), Davidson Academy, USN

 

District 5 Carroll Academy (Huntingdon), Jackson Christian (Jackson), Trinity Christian (Jackson), Fayette Academy (Somerville), Univ. School Jackson (Jackson)

 

District 6 Bishop Byrne, First Assembly, Immaculate Conception, Lausanne, Lighthouse Christian, Memphis Catholic

Rossville Christian, St. George’s, SBEC, Tipton-Rosemark

Class AA:

East: Baylor, GPS, McCallie, Webb, Notre Dame

 

Middle: BGA, Brentwood Academy, Ensworth, Ryan, Harpeth Hall, John Paul II, MBA, St. Cecilia, Lipscomb

 

West: Briarcrest, CBHS, ECS, Hutchison, MUS, St. Agnes, St. Benedict, St. Mary’s

 

What would be so bad about this set-up?

 

I see some teams that would have weak competition in their district. You know this whole private vs. public debate could swing back and forth from year to year. Privates in our area do not recruit. All but one of our starters on this years baseball team are from the same town. The quality of most programs, private or public, depends on the group of kids coming thru that certain program at any given time. In 2006 there was plenty of public representation on championship day in baseball - 1A Mckenzie beat Forrest 2A - Covington beat USJ 3A - Farragut beat Bartlett Where was all the roaring then ? In 2005 -Houston, Overton, Pigeon Forge. In the 70's I played for a good public school and we played all the privates in the area (CBHS, Briarcrest, SBEC, Bishop Byrne, MUS, Towering Oaks, Skyview, FACS, etc. )Sometimes we won and sometimes we got stomped. I don't remember near the amount of controversy at that time. Just glad to be playing.

[Indian]

Last year's results were probably a one-year thing, as everyone left in A adjusted to good programs moving on. It certainly didn't change softball, and it's almost a lock Trinity will win it two more years at least. That will make around 28 of 30. There will always be teams coming out of lesser districts, whether you're talking public or private or combined. It would all even out in the playoffs even if some teams would have an easier route to get there. Those that weren't too strong would be put out quickly. One way to do it with six districts would be four from each district advance, and the top 8 (1 from each district and two wildcards) get a first round bye. That would leave 16 and you could go from there. A final 8 in football from last season could have ended with Catholic, Boyd-Buchanan, Temple, Friendship in the East, Goodpasture, CPA, Jackson Christian, maybe someone like Bishop Byrne in the West. Plenty of great matchups. Softball this year might have ended up Trinity vs Goodpasture (actual A vs AA champs this year), baseball Goodpasture vs Jackson Christian. There would be no lack of competition, when you have programs like Temple basketball, Goodpasture softball, USJ baseball and many more in various sports. There would be plenty of individual stars too, not just in boys' sports, arguably the top two girls players in the state headed into next year attend private schools.

[BDURHAM]

Your suggestion is a break from the recent arguments.

One problem with your suggestion is that there were

privates in the largest classification at one point in time.

 

Why do you think we have DII and the multiplier?

 

Putting all privates in AAA would not be fair. A total

split is the only reasonable solution.

 

QUOTE(therock @ May 26 2007 - 11:44 PM) 826467895[/snapback]Did noone like my idea of putting them all in AAA. I know AAA wouldnt like it.

[MPHSTIGERS87]

QUOTE(JaxMan @ May 26 2007 - 09:38 PM) 826467822[/snapback]that is correct...what's your point...I said we have some advantages...we have fans who can pay it(one of our advantages)...it buys equipment for all our sports...not sure what it has to do with me favoring a split to 3 classes...but you are correct...corporate sponsors who make a $1,000 donation to our booster club get two season passes to all games, a stadium seat, cap and a parking spot close to the gate...this may say as much about why we can't find common ground as anything...as a private supporter I come out in favor of a plan that gives small publics what they want...and instead of agreement or dialogue a public school supporter wants to make a dig at how we raise money for our program...

 

 

Money is not an issue as to how good a team is. I also accused JCS of the $1000 parking spot. Hey, if they can do it, so be it. Jax really help clear that up and he agrees there are disadvantages to publics but he also sees that same disadvantage happening to his school if the split isnt properly handled right. Correct me if I'm wrong Jax , but that the way I read it. How schools raise money is there business. Thats were one of the disadvantsges comes from; a small private in Nashville, Memphis, Jackson, or Chattanooga can raise so much more money compared to a small rural community of 3000 to 5000 people. Should that keep the privates from raising their money? Of course not. They should just be in a different classification.

[JaxMan]

QUOTE(MPHSTIGERS87 @ May 27 2007 - 07:46 AM) 826467941[/snapback]Money is not an issue as to how good a team is. I also accused JCS of the $1000 parking spot. Hey, if they can do it, so be it. Jax really help clear that up and he agrees there are disadvantages to publics but he also sees that same disadvantage happening to his school if the split isnt properly handled right. Correct me if I'm wrong Jax , but that the way I read it. How schools raise money is there business. Thats were one of the disadvantsges comes from; a small private in Nashville, Memphis, Jackson, or Chattanooga can raise so much more money compared to a small rural community of 3000 to 5000 people. Should that keep the privates from raising their money? Of course not. They should just be in a different classification.

 

 

Agreed...I grew up in a small rural community...we loved our teams...but we couldn't raise money as well as JCS can today...I think a split is coming...I just want it to be fair for all at the end of the day

[MPHSTIGERS87]

QUOTE(JaxMan @ May 27 2007 - 08:21 AM) 826467945[/snapback]Agreed...I grew up in a small rural community...we loved our teams...but we couldn't raise money as well as JCS can today...I think a split is coming...I just want it to be fair for all at the end of the day

 

 

Jax, it is great to have a real debate with you. Wether we agree or not it stays civil. I know it started out rough (after the semi-final game) but you are a great person and represent what private schools are all about.