Classification and enrollment appeals

[Backyardbbq15]

When it comes to small schools having a winning tradition and gold/silver ball tradition is like apples and oranges. You can argue both sides all day long, but true rural small schools will always be at a disadvantage compared to the other A-AA schools that have a much bigger pool to pull from or when larger programs are able to pull kids away from smaller schools nearby. Examples that comes to mind in East TN         ( Greenville, Elizabethton).  It does make a difference in the playoffs when you have enough kids to run in and out the whole game for breathers instead of using the same ones both ways all game.  You can win 7-10 games every year and be a winning tradition, but go out 1st/2nd round also, then when you go 3rd/4th/finals every year it’s a different winning tradition. There is not an easy solution, in my own opinion, I think charters, magnets, etc. have had an advantage for years. I would love to see schools that are not normally a 3rd, 4th, finals team get that chance more than every once in a blue moon when they get that “one good” team.  Look at Cloudland last year, it had been several years since they went to the title game and lost in semis.  Probably going to be a few years before they are able to get back near that level, just can’t do it with 160-170 total kids every year, compared to South Pitt that is there every year with 340+ kids.  

[mrbigster]

37 minutes ago, VOLnWTN said:

Let's go tell that to Gleason, Greenfield, Dresden, McKenzie, Perry County, Lake Co., etc......who can only play with the kids that are zoned to that school.  Please.  Go back to your DII boards and cry that over at TCA.  Maybe TCA needs to recruit a little harder to hang with USJ anc JCS. 

(BTW...This post is totally out of character for me, but some things just really get under my skin.)

I agree.Its not a level playing field.TSSAA just wanting money.Theres no way a true Single A rural school has a chance year after year to competing.Sometimes,have that one great class come along but it's hard competing year after year.LC has been fortunate to be pretty good with only about 200 students.Gleason does ok with what they have,guess maybe 150 students?I'm assuming half those are female which brings it to around 75.Then take in effect,some are freshmen.Doesnt leave very many .So to even field a team at LC and South Fulton is pretty good.Look at Mase and have 60 players.LC about 25.Ireally wonder how some schools do it.Trenton and Hunt in AA.Union City looks like Jackson and in Single A.Mase will be able to get students from all over Memphis.Just don't see why TSSAA can't come up with a plan if you want to play sports,go to school you are zoned in.If you want little Johnny to go play at Alcoa,move there.I

[mrbigster]

And my post isn't about playing Trenton,Union City,Hunt etc.Id rather play those teams than maybe A Fulton Co and win by 50 points.Just there needs to be a true cutoff for the Gleasons,LC, and Greennfields.Im ok with the cutoff now.Dont want it to be 275 and be easy.Im just stating,Halls looks like a Single A town that was AA for years.I know it's a big county.So is Obion Co.I just don't buy the Union City enrollment.Cant be thst many going to Central.And if so,why would a city student zoned for Union City be allowed.Seems the schools shouldn't let that hapoen.From my belief,a kid from Dyer Co can't go to Dyersburg per agreement by the schools.Maybe Purple knows.But it's not fair to small schools to let kids from all over Memphis go to a school of their choice

[mrbigster]

I guess Middle Colkege,Bluff City,Freedom Prep be losing some football players next year

[rlh]

1 hour ago, Backyardbbq15 said:

W years before they are able to get back near that level, just can’t do it with 160-170 total kids every year, compared to South Pitt that is there every year with 340+ kids.  

Pump the brakes on the misinformation.  This year, 303 is the highest enrollment recorded for SP since the playoffs began in 1969.  In 2007, they had 223 students and beat a team in the finals that was moving up to 2A the following year.  They lost 2 title games against UC that flirts with being a large 1 and 2a every classification cycle, SP had under 250 students in both games against UC as well as the game against Wayne County and Jo Byrnes.  They lost in OT in 1986 in the Class a final to a team that moved up to AA the following year.  Furthermore, SP is in fact in a rural county.    Gordonsville has always more students including this year.

 

Edit:  For that matter, Sale Creek has had higner enrollments than SP since starting a football team, and Whitwell has had higher numbers for decades. 

Edited November 18, 2022 by rlh

[rlh]

20 hours ago, eyeintheskytn said:

Marshall County move denied

Midway move denied

Warren County move approved

York approved

Scotts Hill denied

Grace denied

 

I am not surprised Grace was denied.  Otherwise, there would be 6 others that could make the same argument including Boyd Buchanon.

[ReitzFan]

1 hour ago, VOLnWTN said:

Let's go tell that to Gleason, Greenfield, Dresden, McKenzie, Perry County, Lake Co., etc......who can only play with the kids that are zoned to that school.  Please.  Go back to your DII boards and cry that over at TCA.  Maybe TCA needs to recruit a little harder to hang with USJ anc JCS. 

(BTW...This post is totally out of character for me, but some things just really get under my skin.)

oh now don't give me that BS. We have had this conversation before. McKenzie is an open enrollment school. You can take in kids outside your zone.  

[IPOPU2022]

1 hour ago, Backyardbbq15 said:

When it comes to small schools having a winning tradition and gold/silver ball tradition is like apples and oranges. You can argue both sides all day long, but true rural small schools will always be at a disadvantage compared to the other A-AA schools that have a much bigger pool to pull from or when larger programs are able to pull kids away from smaller schools nearby. Examples that comes to mind in East TN         ( Greenville, Elizabethton).  It does make a difference in the playoffs when you have enough kids to run in and out the whole game for breathers instead of using the same ones both ways all game.  You can win 7-10 games every year and be a winning tradition, but go out 1st/2nd round also, then when you go 3rd/4th/finals every year it’s a different winning tradition. There is not an easy solution, in my own opinion, I think charters, magnets, etc. have had an advantage for years. I would love to see schools that are not normally a 3rd, 4th, finals team get that chance more than every once in a blue moon when they get that “one good” team.  Look at Cloudland last year, it had been several years since they went to the title game and lost in semis.  Probably going to be a few years before they are able to get back near that level, just can’t do it with 160-170 total kids every year, compared to South Pitt that is there every year with 340+ kids.  

Cloudland somehow always finds a way to field a competitive team. No city close by to draw from. That community has always impressed me. 

[Backyardbbq15]

44 minutes ago, rlh said:

Pump the brakes on the misinformation.  This year, 303 is the highest enrollment recorded for SP since the playoffs began in 1969.  In 2007, they had 223 students and beat a team in the finals that was moving up to 2A the following year.  They lost 2 title games against UC that flirts with being a large 1 and 2a every classification cycle, SP had under 250 students in both games against UC as well as the game against Wayne County and Jo Byrnes.  They lost in OT in 1986 in the Class a final to a team that moved up to AA the following year.  Furthermore, SP is in fact in a rural county.    Gordonsville has always more students including this year.

 

Edit:  For that matter, Sale Creek has had higner enrollments than SP since starting a football team, and Whitwell has had higher numbers for decades. 

I’m sorry about the misprint on the numbers, what I’m getting at is SP like others have a bigger number than other rural A schools and are in later rounds year end and out. They are good every year and I give due credit to the coaching staff.  Whether it’s 260 or 300 kids, it’s still 40-50% more than say Cloudland or Coalfield. That makes a difference, you can’t deny that.  It occurs at AA also,  the whole state saw that with the AA game last year.  If I was a betting person, I would bet that some of the larger A/AA schools would not go as far as they do, if there pool of kids were reduced by 40-50%. Not hating on anyone, but a small team can only replace with what’s available and when you only have 6-10 new kids each year, it’s harder than when you have 10-20 new ones.  The ability to exchange a a couple extra persons during  can make a big difference at the A/AA level. 

[1983]

16 minutes ago, ReitzFan said:

oh now don't give me that BS. We have had this conversation before. McKenzie is an open enrollment school. You can take in kids outside your zone.  

 

1 hour ago, mrbigster said:

I agree.Its not a level playing field.TSSAA just wanting money.Theres no way a true Single A rural school has a chance year after year to competing.Sometimes,have that one great class come along but it's hard competing year after year.LC has been fortunate to be pretty good with only about 200 students.Gleason does ok with what they have,guess maybe 150 students?I'm assuming half those are female which brings it to around 75.Then take in effect,some are freshmen.Doesnt leave very many .So to even field a team at LC and South Fulton is pretty good.Look at Mase and have 60 players.LC about 25.Ireally wonder how some schools do it.Trenton and Hunt in AA.Union City looks like Jackson and in Single A.Mase will be able to get students from all over Memphis.Just don't see why TSSAA can't come up with a plan if you want to play sports,go to school you are zoned in.If you want little Johnny to go play at Alcoa,move there.I

McKenzie and Union City are not 1A type schools!  They should be playing up for the next few years.  

[Pirate2003]

2 hours ago, Backyardbbq15 said:

compared to South Pitt that is there every year with 340+ kids.  

Probably need to check numbers. SP had 300 students this year. Did some digging and it took a few hours this morning. I couldn’t find any year with 340+. It’s actually the first time in over 35 years SP has had over 280 kids. Most of the past 35 years was between 220-250 kids. We have routinely been a middle of the road 1A school enrollment wise. We are a small, rural school. Just not as small as some others as we have never dipped under 200 students. 

[TheTruthPrevails]

Instead of fixing classifications where someone else can win a title, the money hungry tssaa should go back to 4 classes where district travel wouldn't be 70+ miles for each game.